Welcome to the Forums. In order to avoid spam messages, we require all users of the forum to register first.

If you are not registered please click on the Register link from the top menu. If you are registered LOGIN here.

16 posts / 0 new
Last post
World's Oldest Writing

Looking now for other examples of ancient text similar to that seen at Lascaux Cave and Chauvet Cave...

This is a link to the Lascaux data

and Chauvet cave....

Does anyone know of any similar patterns found at any other site?

Ancient Astrology

Rappenglueck as well as Edge have calculated the ancients had created a calender and that the drawings were constellations. The most convincing piece of evidence was the Pleiades being located on the back of a bull in the cave. His calender dating agrees with the professional dating of the cave, indicating that man, while awaiing the creation of television became star gazers. What I liked about the information was that the constellations were larger than what they were today. There is indication in star names and in religious myth that this was the case. I believe the break up of the constellations created a second wave of gods in Egypt as well as altered religious beliefs including one Biblical story.

I have a theory that the earliest alphabet was derived from the constellations, but never followed through on it.

Noticed the reduction in the size of the constellations too...

Noticed the reduction in the size of the constellations in my own syudy of Lascaux...What is today the wing star of Cygnus all the way to the first stars of Hercules was originally drawn as a Bull, with the eye being an ancient North Pole star.

Hercules and the bull combuined then became the Minotaur in ancient stories, a link further created by adding Taurus to the drawing.

One of the secondary results is the data for ancient writing also fully explains the Mayan reset. 

Dr. Derek Cunningham
Author of:
The Map that Talked -
The Babel Texts - The book that decodes the early geometric text of the Stone Age
Scotland and Shakespeare's Third Prophecy - Recovering Scotland's Past forgotten past

Constellation writing...


The theory you had about constellation based writing.....does it match in any way the data I'm getting, which uses eclipse values?

Dr. Derek Cunningham
Author of:
The Map that Talked -
The Babel Texts - The book that decodes the early geometric text of the Stone Age
Scotland and Shakespeare's Third Prophecy - Recovering Scotland's Past forgotten past


No Derek,

My idea wasplaying around with the Phonecian alphabet. I could correspond their "A" to the constellation Taurus, but then I couldn't go on from there with any rhyme, reson or consistancy.


Also the caves had several bulls in their drawings, i.e. it was not uncommon to use the same symbol more than once. There was a bull at the Taurus location similar to the one we have today. It had white dots on its back which looked similar to the seven sisters, although there were 8 stars which would indicate the stars were brighter or man could see better.

.....I think it is 50:50 

.....I think it is 50:50 

Some letters came from the geometrical aspect as shown in my work

other from the shape drawn by the Milky Way (either the X or O shape)

others still could very well be related to constellations.....Cygnus for example could draw either a Y or a t shape.

Older texts were however Ogham type with line and stem....




Dr. Derek Cunningham
Author of:
The Map that Talked -
The Babel Texts - The book that decodes the early geometric text of the Stone Age
Scotland and Shakespeare's Third Prophecy - Recovering Scotland's Past forgotten past


I was attempting to get more involved. Each letter of the Hebrew alphabet has a specific meaning. I was attempting to related that meaning through the corresponding old testament story of a constellation that in turn resembled the letter. My basic theory is that the Old Testament stories was a cosmic myth, a combination of history and fiction, which was used as an astrological/astronomical guide book of the heavens. There was a basic story that stemmed from Bronze Age babylon (heavy emphasis on Akkadian/Ur) formed by the conquering Amorites who combined Ur stories with their Amorite names. This work was greatly altered as the text became a living document with additions being added using the same identical techniques Tigay proposed for the expansion of Gilgamesh. It is the best of a combination of unified text theory and document hypothesis utilizing techniques which we know for a fact existed in that era.

I was trying to work in the alphabet, but with my book at over 140,000 words including end notes, it was too much having already changed the how, where, when and why the Bible was written.

dear Derek Cunningham

decoding the early text, now i can see the letters related to the stars. but geometry is not the same as the bases of letters/numbers. and the babelonian text is one that  hides much more then has ever been seen by the uninitiated.


first language

both of you are right. the signs of the zodiac and geometry. the wheels within wheels. the zodiac cycle or mazzaroth of 25920 before the fall and 25918.2 after the fall. before, it was Adam kadon. his value is 18.  so there was a heavenly garden and therefore two heavenly trees in the middle of that garden , the tree of knowledge and the tree of life. the present kabbalistic trees are not the correct trees, they were part of the sacred secret. but with the circles and paths 3,7 and 12 all letters can be placed. ( a little secret! the stone tablets were two circular tablets) another hint was given in the torah, the vessel that broke into 288 sparks.

and eliphas Levi gave another, he who joins the hexagram and pentagram has solved half of the sacred secret. while i do not fully agree with him because without having the two keys and understanding the first language it will only be 1/8th  then and only then can one read the story in the ‘’signs’’  without one iota out of place.  sadly the truth finds no ears, neither science or religion can assist for they seek to find proof of their theories and reject all that does not fit it.  unlike so many think, the story of healing the blind wasn,t about physical blindness , when the known was used to describe the unknown and after the fall of babylon they took the describtion as the truth. while a very little group passed the truth on through, the ages the last magi passed away mid 1900. the last and final adapt now shares and takes off the blindfolds of little groups in preparation from russia to europe asia etc. to carry forth the eternal flame when total darkness befalls humanity. i do realize this all sounds prophetic while only giving a few hints. but to attain the SANCTUM REGNUM, in other words, the knowledge and power of the Magi, The magician avails himself of a force which he knows, the sorcerer seeks to misuse that which he does not understand. If it be possible in a scientific work to employ a term so vulgar and so discredited, then the devil gives himself to the magician and the sorcerer gives himself to the devil. The magician is the sovereign pontiff of Nature, the sorcerer is her profaner only. The sorcerer is in the same relation to the magician that a superstitious and fanatical person bears to a truly religious man. Before proceeding further, let us define Magic in a sentence. Magic is the traditional science of the secrets of Nature which has been transmitted to us from the Magi. 
One has to free oneself of that which intoxicates and blinds you. As we do not give a knife to either a child or emotionally driven adult who, dazzled by its beauty, lusts for its power to feed itself at the cost of starving his fellow man. 
To know thyself and discover one’s true nature through death of ego is the true key into the inner sanctum. As the true meaning is often lost, magi means wise man. Those who have a grain and consider themselves wise are charlatans. So be forewarned there are thousands of such false prophets hunting for your souls and wallets with books, high paid courses, expensive guided trips to ancient sites, sale videos or amulets, read your horoscope or read your hand or cards in exchange for cash, don’t let them be the sirens that lure you into the depth. They could learn from a devout monk who’s bowl was for food or shelter anything else would be to assist to help others for either physical or spiritual food,

few have found their way and recognized , most remain slave without ever knowing. many think they have untied themselves in Plato,s cave some even think they walk outside of the cave, but do not understand to be in it but not of it. that its not about going outside of the cave but having ego consumed by the flame.



ledom Said: I was attempting to get more involved. Each letter of the Hebrew alphabet has a specific meaning. I was attempting to related that meaning through the corresponding old testament story of a constellation that in turn resembled the letter.


H. West: I never thought of a connection from the stars of the heavens to the Hebrew Alf-Bet. I knew the stars of the heavens were once called the “Way” or the Guide. With the 12 tribes symbolizing the zodiacal constellations and “The Battle for the Control of Mankind” in the Northern Horizon circle.


I, therefore, took a different “tack” to my conclusions. Both the Hebrew and Greek alphabets have the same order as the northern Semite alphabet of the Hittites, the Greek and Hebrew alphabets also mirror the early Ugaritic Cuneiform symbol because they were all alphanumeric/ heliographic codes.


These alphabets allowed the most used letters to have the simplest symbol that corresponds to 1, 5, 10, 2, 4, 6, 9, 50 and 100. Here is the kicker; the message or text being copied could be totaled, so that when it was received a line cipher was given with the numeric total of the message or line by line, therefore, if the totals did not match up? The mismatch allowed the error to be discovered and allowed message be re-sent or corrected. There are at least two places where this principle is still used, first with Hebrew text scribes and computer code writing so that the errors in the written code can be found if the computer or software has a malfunction and which allows the line cipher to locate where the error is so that error can be fixed. It is a long story, therefore here are a few blog links to my conclusions.



Arithmomancy the Past and Future Told by Numbers and Light

Princess Entiu-ny

The Golden Shields of Solomon and NASA

The Wings of Pegasus

Medusa and Hydra Unraveled



I disagree with everybody in this modern world, just as Cassandra of Troy did so long ago.

Noticed the reduction in of the constellations too.....

Was this the original Bull of Heaven and is there a picture of this ancient constellation? Were there more? If so what are they?

White Owl

The eye of the cosmic bull is

The eye of the cosmic bull is the wing star of Cygnus....the rest of the bull is the constellation Lyra and one side of hercules.

This means that  back of the bull was pole "star" 11,500 years ago (this was taken by globular cluster M92) and the eye was north pole star about 16,000 years ago. Lyra can also be considered to have a north pole constellation.

The remaining stars of Hercules link with Draco to become a large dragon....

The oldest drawing I have found showing this is the Lascaux cave image in the Shaft of the dead man


Dr. Derek Cunningham
Author of:
The Map that Talked -
The Babel Texts - The book that decodes the early geometric text of the Stone Age
Scotland and Shakespeare's Third Prophecy - Recovering Scotland's Past forgotten past

Recently published some

Recently published some additional data from South America and Israel...again the astronomical values for elipse predicitons appear to match the drawn images.




Dr. Derek Cunningham
Author of:
The Map that Talked -
The Babel Texts - The book that decodes the early geometric text of the Stone Age
Scotland and Shakespeare's Third Prophecy - Recovering Scotland's Past forgotten past

Zodiac language


It is fascinating to consider an alphabet could apply to the constellations, when in fact a language is quite true. It has been revealed that the original design of the constellations actually relate to three specific levels. The original design you may know as Kaalapurusha represents this. The first level is the correlation to the human anatomy. The months around the celestial belt relate to parts of the human body. The second and apparently lost correlation, is that the Worldly symbols actually relate to the World and the zones around the equatorial belt. These symbols also relate to the parts of the body, each symbol has a dynamic related to the parts of the body. ie aries horns top of head, bull neck.... These were characteristics related to the different zones of the World body. It was considered the stars were a pattern for the World and this is the third level and established a connection to the Celestial body .

The head of our body connected to the head of the World body and this connected to the head of the Celestial body. This was a language that spread around the World and is still alive today. Take a trip around the equator and follow the design set by our ancient ones. Start at Leo the sphinx.    

If you are interested in seeing an updated realignment of this original concept, the World body from head to tail and the Celestial body from head to tail, Here is a link to a series of articles and if you can grasp this pattern a new language will be available for you to discover. 

 Cheers Barry

This makes us real curious,

This makes us real curious, but very hard to explore. I had heard of Harappan writing. I wonder if it has been explored any further. 

Enjoys ancient trivia

I started investigating this.

I started investigating this. In a short time you realise that the constellations or various patterns are determined by where you are in the World. Equatorially the galactic cofiguration passes directly overhead where as close to the poles the galactic band rotates. This rotation gives a natural meaning to patterns at different times of year. Constellation patterns start popping up all over the place. Here is a short article with a few references….

The Earth rotates around the sun with all of the planets on the ecliptic plane. For life in our solar system especially here on Earth, this is one of the major influencial cycles. The stars that align with this plane are defined as the zodiac belt which as we rotate around the sun we move towards the stars around this belt. This motion is almost perpindicular to the Milky way plane. Early records of the stars on this ecliptic plane were detailed as individual stars called decans. Early records of these stars helped develop the calandar and the record of time as it was observed we moved towards the star patterns on a cyclic motion, recording the seasons, months and days determined by the return of the position of the stars. As the star positions determined the events on Earth a connection was established and the heavens the larger macrocosmic formations became a source of influence and were considered creative energies.

“depictions of the Egyptian female deity Nut, which translates as “night”, and was mythological / astronomically ascribed to arching over the earth, and spreading over it as the vault of the sky. Nut was traditionally and consistently considered as arching over the earth in an East-to-West direction, giving birth to the astronomical bodies (such as the Sun, Moon, stars and planets) in the eastern horizon, and “eating” them as they reached the western horizon.”  AW


Studying the influence of the stars and time, developed over thaousands of years. The 36 decan stars were later grouped into sets of three stars resulting in 12 constellations dividing a yearly rotation into 12 months. The connection between the stars and Earth also created interest with other subjects. As the expression “As above so below” also determined that by studying the World we could gain knowledge of the energies exerted by the Celestial realm. Plenty of information is bringing to light that ancient cultures were travelling and communicating circling the globe. Knowledge of numerous scattered ancient sites link together as Geodetic sites and Mother Earth worshipers as well as studies of Landscape zodiacs and other studies are all studies of the connections between the stars and the Earth. In addition to investigations into the stars, terrestrial life was also under investigation. Information connecting distant sites and cultures through artifacts, food, DNA, written texts, animal fossils is a continuously growing field.


“Clearly, a similarity between two scripts does not automatically mean that they both originated from the same source. However, as can be seen from the examples above, there is now sufficient evidence in favor of just such a connection, and however frail that connection may seem it continues to be the most likely solution to the remarkable similarities between the Indus Valley and Easter island Scripts. Without another, more plausible suggestion we are left with a limited number of possibilities to explain such a connection.”  AW


The modern zodiac belt is now well known as 12 constellations and these can be seen connecting to the twelve parts of the body with Aries connecting to the head to Pisces connecting to the feet. Likewise this is seen as the Celestial body of Nut dividing into the twelve constellations from head to tail. This anatomy connection is well advanced in the field of medical astrology where the connection to the point of your anatomy is determined by your birth and the correlation of your independence from the womb to the position in the Celestial body or the month in which you are born. A person when stressed may become affected at this point of the anatomy but may also be affected at the point of another if stress is applied by this another person. Medical astrology or Vedic astrology details principals of which the position of the sun, moon and planets alter the flow of energy between the Celestial body and our bodies with altering energy effects.

The zodiac belt which we circumnavigate is made up of twelve constellation signs. Each of these signs represent the twelve parts of the body. Aries has the distinguishing feature of the horns and represents this part of the body. Pisces has the unique feature of our animals as the tail fin and connects to the feet. Taurus has the big distinctive neck of the bull, Leo is the lungs and heart area and has the unique mane for the feline family wrapped around the torso. Sagitarius is the thigh blend into the thighs of the horse, while in the middle of the body is the pivoting central falcrum represented by the scales.  Interestingly each of the signs are iconic symbols from Earth and even more interestingly as the ecliptic is divided up into twelve, if you divide the World around the equator into twelve many enlightening links can be made. The study of the World correlated with a study of the stars and these connections have been recorded in many ancient monuments and records in each zone around the World. Leo aligns with the sphinx of Egypt and in the next zone sits the land of Israel once known as the land of Virgo, cemented by Mr Christ and the Virgin Mary. Another step around the globe coincides with the cental falcrum of the World body where balance or karma is expressed.

On the other side of Leo sits Cancer, slightly Northern and so stonehenge sits which also takes the form of the cancer iconic symbol chosen because of the dominant crab from this region. We could jump to Easter Island where rather delightfully the Heads of Easer Island sit mysteriously and majestically.

Search the globe for many more connections and it soon becomes aparent that these iconic symbols represent the World body expressing variations in nature that moves to the design of the body. This study as well as a more three dimensional investigation links the twelve zones together.

The anatomical zones of the human body connect to the twelve zones of the Earth and became inserted when projecting these back to the twelve zones of our surrounding ecliptic zodiac belt. This binds many global stories together when you realise the body of the Earth connects to our Celestial body. As the cycle of the stars became connected to the zones of the World, it was the observations of the World zones that produced the zodiac signs and became projected to these corresponding zones on the Celestial zodiac belt.


This concept extended to the belief that the Universal template consist of this basic design and it describes how our more local structures, the Earth the zodiac belt and life on Earth are manifestations of this Universal template, as microcosmic formations.

Egyptian connection between Nut and Geb the Zodiac belt and Earth

Here we see like a print how the design of our Celestial zodiac band and body represented by the star filled Nut connects with the band around the World body represented by Geb the base figure. I have spent years studying the dynamics of our Worlds animals itemising distinguishable dynamic features as well as identifying variations within species globally distributed and the more I see the more evidence is gathered linking these features to the correlated World anatomical formation.  


"Parsamian's discovery at Metsamor, and the stones at Sissian give concrete credence to Maunder's and Olkott's theories, especially when coupled with ca. 4,000�3,000 BC stone carvings of zodiac figures on rocks on the Geghama Mountain Range in Armenia.".AW


Revelations (Rev 21,12) which mentions the '...12 gates of the celestial city..', it also enigmatically describes the dimensions of the city as a perfect cube with length, width, and height of 12,000 furlongs. A cube of course, is hardly the ultimate design for a 'heaven on earth', and there has been much work on the idea that such references are purely symbolic, although interestingly, AW


“A Rig Vedic hymn refers to the twelve fixed parts of the wheel and to the twelve forms with connection to the sun. The hymn next describes the twelve lunar months specifically mentioning the thirteenth additional month required in this scheme. A Rig Vedic hymn to the Asvins, quoted in the Mahabharata, also refers to the twelve zodiac signs. Undoubtedly, the twelve zodiacal signs were known. Other hymns support this conclusion. AW


The Observatory - The observatory rivals the discoveries at the citadel for importance, substantiating theories on the birthplace of the zodiac and origins of astronomy in the ancient world.  Dated ca. 2,800-2,500 BC, when the zodiac is figured to have been concluded, the observatory was also the primary religious site and navigation center for the Metsamorian culture.”  (AW)   [email protected]  


Willy Hartner detailed his conclusions of a zodiacal constellation tradition which was fixed before c. 4000 BCE. Hartner followed the motif of lion and bull, reflecting the constellations Leo and Taurus, through over five thousand years of incorporation into ancient near-eastern architectural design, statues, and pottery.  He admits the earliest constellation names are Sumerian, but places their authorship well before the Sumerian period by charting the appropriate helical risings of Leo and Taurus during the first half of February, the time for “plowing, harrowing, and sowing,” c. 4000 BCE (AW)


When viewed from the Sphinx the pyramid tips could be calculated to coinciding with the rising constellation of Leo (BS)