Pity all we have are conjectures and theories. Without Cleopatra’s body we certainly have no proof. Even if the body was found, it would be terribly difficult for an account to be made, since it was so long ago.
Kersten did not ‘prove’ the cloth is real nor that it’s the burial cloth of Jesus. He put forward very strong evidence and theory based upon the known information about the cloth. What he did demonstrate quite well is that regardless of ‘who’ was wrapped in the cloth, that person was ALIVE and not dead. There are over 22 wounds that continued to bleed AFTER the body was wrapped. Some quite profusely like the hands, feet and side wound that rand down and puddled behind the body. Corpses DON’T bleed!
It wasn’t alum on the cloth, but the “Aloes and Myrrh of a hundred pound weight” (healing agents not embalming agents)which was brought to the tomb by Nicodemus. It’s right there in John’s gospel. What was being made was an enormous poultice bandage to wrap the body of someone who was severly injured but NOT DEAD. Jews don’t and never did embalm their dead. Crucifixion wounds are not fatal. It is a long slow torturous death taking sometimes days. The bible states Jesus was on the cross 3 hours before he ‘gave up his spirit’. He drank the ‘gall’ which was actually a narcotic and immediately lapsed into unconsciousness – hence the rush to get him down, not break his legs and get him healing.
The Gospel of Peter (not included in your standard bible) states ‘jesus was seen leaving the tomb supported by 2 men dressed in white. (Essenes)
Jesus left the area and travelled with his mother toward India. Mary is buried in Afghanistan. Jesus’ real tomb is in Srinigar Kashmir where he died at the age of over 100 years. Rosa Bal is the name of the tomb and it’s revered to this day by the locals as the tomb of a great spiritual teacher, one Jus Asaf. Tombofjesus.com has all the facts and can educate anyone interested. But this was the gist of Kersten’s book. “IF” this cloth held the body of Jesus, it proves he was a man, it proves he didn’t die on the cross, and it destroys the very foundation of christianity’s claims of resurrection and ascension. And that wouldn’t bode well for the Vatican at all now would it? Kersten’s work brings Jesus down to the level of human. A highly trained spiritual adept – but not a god. It’s a very good book and well researched.
What do these questions have to do with the price of cheese in Outer Wierdistan .. or are you just trying to be a smart-ass (you succeeded - congratulations). BTW, 1 = yes, plus -a- =lot= more (think about the wording for a second, of both the question -and- the answer. 2 = nope. 3 = not hardly!
That the head of Medusa was used "as a Force of Protection" is, in my view, an important clue to the origin of the myth;
The head of Medusa, was carried in a magic container which was plated with a precious metal, and was the Perseid equivalent to the Ark of the Covenant. "… the head of the monster, the dreaded Gorgo, and the bag floated about it, a wonder to look at, done in silver, but the shining tassels fluttered, and they were gold, ..." (Shield of Heracles 220-237). The special attribute of this magic container was that it could contain anything, no matter how great, within its space, without increasing in its bulk. This was probably in reference to the unbelievable fact that the great Yahweh spoke from the relatively tiny Ark. Medusa's head was kept in its magic container because no one could look upon it and yet live, it was carried into battles, showed to the enemy, and thus insured the victories for Perseus, in the same way that the Ark and its contents was used by Israel (a rare motif indeed). The primary method of capital punishment that was prescribed by the Law, was stoning. This, no doubt, left numerous piles of stones as "monuments" to those who violated the Law, all along the way of the wandering Zion, just as we imagine the way of Medusa to be strewn with stone statues of those whom she had put to death. It is not inconceivable that whenever a violator of the law was discovered there was a ritualistic reading (looking upon) of the law that was violated which preceded the stony execution. Thus leading to the myth that it was the "looking upon" of the object itself that brought about the subsequent death.
It occurs to me that the most likely origin for the Greek name "Medusa," is that it derives from the Hebrew word that has come down to us as, "Mitzwah,"which means, "commandments."
"If that hadn’t happened, there was a chance we wouldn’t be a free country today. It is stories like these that need to be told." An interesting thought, meaning I suppose that America would still be enslaved - like Canada.
You guys don't do much in the way of "research", do you?
Several years ago ((1980s?? 1990s??)) a German theologian set out to prove, once and for all, that 'The Shroud' was a fake. His name is Holger Kersten and the book he wrote about his research is titled, "Jesus Lived in India". Fortunately or unfortunately, what he wound up doing is proving it was not only "real", but there was -all- =sorts= of corroberating (sp?) things he uncovered as well.
For example, -The- =Shroud=, itself, has =never= been tested. What was used for testing was the -edge- -binding-, which the Vatican's own records show was donated about 1300 CE. Why? The Shroud itself was considered too valuable, too holy, to cut a piece off for something as 'trivial' as testing.
Another fex, how was the 'image' produced on the cloth? My expertise is not in chemistry, but as I understand it, the cloth was soaked in alum, which was a common (medical??) thing at that time. If the body was still alive when it was wrapped up, it would sweat like in a sauna and the various salts would combine with the alum to make a "photo-like" image on the cloth. Very simple, no "mystery" at all .. if you know anything about chemistry.
One of the things he did in his research was particularly "damning", in some ways. He -did- =NOT= rely on -strictly- 'European' records!! There were -other- learned cultures besides just the Romans, at that time. So, he checked Persian and Indian archives, too. All I'm going to say ((I'm hoping some of you will actually read the book, yourselves)) here is something that =should= be -obvious- .. but is far too easily overlooked today. Euro-centricity (sp?) can sometimes be a very 'dangerous' set of blinders, -especially- when working on something on the 'frontier' of Europe!
Regarding what was used to 'stab' the person known to us as Jesus, the Christ, yes, the Romans had what we today call a "lance" or "spear". The 'pilum' was as someone described above -- a 'needle' with a wooden haft, more or less -- =however=, it was an item used 'in the field' ((any former service member knows what that means and what the distinction is)), =not= while on garrison duty. "Spears" -were- used in towns, etc, but that 'thing' in the silver case in that picture -is- =not= a 'spear head', period, full stop! A specifically made pseudo-artifact, sure, easily, but a 'duty object' to be used 'for real'? Sorry, not a chance.
Perhaps someone should mention that is 100% the fault of the United States that there are unexploded cluster bombs all over this region? Oh wait I just did. The bombing raids on supposed communist positions destroyed many of these artifacts and continue to put the entire population at risk. Merica.
"You can't discover anything if someone has not only been there before you, but someone else also lives there."
I have to disagree with this. "Discovery" is relative, and the scope of the relation is implicit in the context in which the word is used.
The scope can be as narrow as a single person, such as, "Little Jonny discovered an odd-looking box tucked away in the back of the closet," or as wide as the whole human race, as in "Scientists announce the discovery of liquid water on Mars."
Between those two extremes are any number of different sizes of groups of people. A family can discover they can get along on holidays if they try. A tribe can discover a new source of water. A society can discover a new method of governance, a civilization can discover a new landmass.
The point is, "discovering" something means finding something previously unknown, and as such it applies only to those doing the discovering--so in the case of Columbus and the Americas, we're talking about "Western Civilization" or "European Civilization" "discovering" the American continent. To say that was a discovery does not imply that no other human had previous knowledge of the Americas.
That said I generally agree with you that Columbus never actually set foot on the main landmass, plus he thought he was in India(or Asia somewhere) and basically was totally wrong in so many ways.
But discoveries can be bumbling and accidental and even unrealized at the time. Most big ones are, actually.
Ancient Bulgaria is thought to have people who originated from the Northern part of the Indian subcontinent. Mukti, moksha and yoga are concepts that predate ancient Bulgaria by eons in pre vedic civilisations.
Here you can navigate quickly through all comments made in any article sorted by date/time.
The El Camino Real or Old Spanish Trail went from St Augustine Fl. to Modesto California and was used in the 1500's.
I o extensive research on the above mentioned subjects and would welcome additional facts.
Great article but there's a typo. The woman who crossed British lines was Lydia Darragh, an Irish immigrant Quaker.
https://www.nwhm.org/education-resources/biography/biographies/lydia-bar...
Pity all we have are conjectures and theories. Without Cleopatra’s body we certainly have no proof. Even if the body was found, it would be terribly difficult for an account to be made, since it was so long ago.
Would have appreciated if the article told more about the head-bust found and why it is thought to be Medusa.
@Uncle D:
I’ve read the book.
What do these questions have to do with the price of cheese in Outer Wierdistan .. or are you just trying to be a smart-ass (you succeeded - congratulations). BTW, 1 = yes, plus -a- =lot= more (think about the wording for a second, of both the question -and- the answer. 2 = nope. 3 = not hardly!
sorry for the spelling errors.
"earth" as an example.
what you say is interesting.. tell me...
1. is the earth and universe 6,000 years old?
2. was the easth flooded in approx 2500 BC and all cultures started over from there.
3. does everyone on earth share the same DNA and are we all descendants of Noah?
That the head of Medusa was used "as a Force of Protection" is, in my view, an important clue to the origin of the myth;
The head of Medusa, was carried in a magic container which was plated with a precious metal, and was the Perseid equivalent to the Ark of the Covenant. "… the head of the monster, the dreaded Gorgo, and the bag floated about it, a wonder to look at, done in silver, but the shining tassels fluttered, and they were gold, ..." (Shield of Heracles 220-237). The special attribute of this magic container was that it could contain anything, no matter how great, within its space, without increasing in its bulk. This was probably in reference to the unbelievable fact that the great Yahweh spoke from the relatively tiny Ark. Medusa's head was kept in its magic container because no one could look upon it and yet live, it was carried into battles, showed to the enemy, and thus insured the victories for Perseus, in the same way that the Ark and its contents was used by Israel (a rare motif indeed). The primary method of capital punishment that was prescribed by the Law, was stoning. This, no doubt, left numerous piles of stones as "monuments" to those who violated the Law, all along the way of the wandering Zion, just as we imagine the way of Medusa to be strewn with stone statues of those whom she had put to death. It is not inconceivable that whenever a violator of the law was discovered there was a ritualistic reading (looking upon) of the law that was violated which preceded the stony execution. Thus leading to the myth that it was the "looking upon" of the object itself that brought about the subsequent death.
It occurs to me that the most likely origin for the Greek name "Medusa," is that it derives from the Hebrew word that has come down to us as, "Mitzwah,"which means, "commandments."
From
See also:
"If that hadn’t happened, there was a chance we wouldn’t be a free country today. It is stories like these that need to be told." An interesting thought, meaning I suppose that America would still be enslaved - like Canada.
I have always been fascinated by the origins of our human story
Jesus is a hoax, ergo: the 'Shroud of Turin' is a hoax.
You guys don't do much in the way of "research", do you?
Several years ago ((1980s?? 1990s??)) a German theologian set out to prove, once and for all, that 'The Shroud' was a fake. His name is Holger Kersten and the book he wrote about his research is titled, "Jesus Lived in India". Fortunately or unfortunately, what he wound up doing is proving it was not only "real", but there was -all- =sorts= of corroberating (sp?) things he uncovered as well.
For example, -The- =Shroud=, itself, has =never= been tested. What was used for testing was the -edge- -binding-, which the Vatican's own records show was donated about 1300 CE. Why? The Shroud itself was considered too valuable, too holy, to cut a piece off for something as 'trivial' as testing.
Another fex, how was the 'image' produced on the cloth? My expertise is not in chemistry, but as I understand it, the cloth was soaked in alum, which was a common (medical??) thing at that time. If the body was still alive when it was wrapped up, it would sweat like in a sauna and the various salts would combine with the alum to make a "photo-like" image on the cloth. Very simple, no "mystery" at all .. if you know anything about chemistry.
One of the things he did in his research was particularly "damning", in some ways. He -did- =NOT= rely on -strictly- 'European' records!! There were -other- learned cultures besides just the Romans, at that time. So, he checked Persian and Indian archives, too. All I'm going to say ((I'm hoping some of you will actually read the book, yourselves)) here is something that =should= be -obvious- .. but is far too easily overlooked today. Euro-centricity (sp?) can sometimes be a very 'dangerous' set of blinders, -especially- when working on something on the 'frontier' of Europe!
Regarding what was used to 'stab' the person known to us as Jesus, the Christ, yes, the Romans had what we today call a "lance" or "spear". The 'pilum' was as someone described above -- a 'needle' with a wooden haft, more or less -- =however=, it was an item used 'in the field' ((any former service member knows what that means and what the distinction is)), =not= while on garrison duty. "Spears" -were- used in towns, etc, but that 'thing' in the silver case in that picture -is- =not= a 'spear head', period, full stop! A specifically made pseudo-artifact, sure, easily, but a 'duty object' to be used 'for real'? Sorry, not a chance.
Perhaps someone should mention that is 100% the fault of the United States that there are unexploded cluster bombs all over this region? Oh wait I just did. The bombing raids on supposed communist positions destroyed many of these artifacts and continue to put the entire population at risk. Merica.
thanks for the compliment, it’s about time someone tells this story!
"You can't discover anything if someone has not only been there before you, but someone else also lives there."
I have to disagree with this. "Discovery" is relative, and the scope of the relation is implicit in the context in which the word is used.
The scope can be as narrow as a single person, such as, "Little Jonny discovered an odd-looking box tucked away in the back of the closet," or as wide as the whole human race, as in "Scientists announce the discovery of liquid water on Mars."
Between those two extremes are any number of different sizes of groups of people. A family can discover they can get along on holidays if they try. A tribe can discover a new source of water. A society can discover a new method of governance, a civilization can discover a new landmass.
The point is, "discovering" something means finding something previously unknown, and as such it applies only to those doing the discovering--so in the case of Columbus and the Americas, we're talking about "Western Civilization" or "European Civilization" "discovering" the American continent. To say that was a discovery does not imply that no other human had previous knowledge of the Americas.
That said I generally agree with you that Columbus never actually set foot on the main landmass, plus he thought he was in India(or Asia somewhere) and basically was totally wrong in so many ways.
But discoveries can be bumbling and accidental and even unrealized at the time. Most big ones are, actually.
If Nickell said the cyphers are a hoax, I'm inclined to think they're probably genuine.
Ancient Bulgaria is thought to have people who originated from the Northern part of the Indian subcontinent. Mukti, moksha and yoga are concepts that predate ancient Bulgaria by eons in pre vedic civilisations.
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