Yeah. Gotta love the complete inattention to how these were carved(inattention of the scientists, not the author of the article), since they only become visible for a few hours every decade or so...while simultaneously suggesting that they may be "centuries old". Last I checked, sea levels have supposedly been fairly stable since about 10k BC.
We live within a universe that is in excess of 14,000,000,000 years old, on a planet that is about 4,000,000,000 years old, in a biosphere that has existed for up to 2,000,000,000 years; modern humans have been around for perhaps 250,000 years, though only 8,000 years of that is recorded history. Modern science has been around for 400 years or so, and current scientists have been here for 80-100 years tops, more like 40, on average.
So when they say "extraordinary", they base that on their experience of roughly %0.00032 of the sum total of humanity's period of existence, and about %0.00000004 of the timespan of life on earth.
A bit lacking in the credibility department in terms of being able to define what is or is not "extraordinary", don't you think?
Thanks for your comment! I'm glad you enjoyed the article.
I think the expanding earth theory is somewhat plausible. But shouldn't we be able to measure expansion if it is really happening? Do you know of any attempts to detect this expansion?
I think the discoverers of this underwater city just gave up trying to get funding for the follow-up expeditions and moved on with their lives...and since the city is in Cuban territorial waters, there's a lot of political red tape, especially if any Americans would be involved..
Thanks for you comment. Geologists would argue that these canyons could have been carved over millions of years by the erosive action of suspended sediments carried by the river as it flowed into the ocean...What do you think about this?
Do you have any solid evidence that this is taking place? It seems like Google would be the last company to censor information in this manner unless there were military or government secrets involved.
Thanks for your comment. I believe the "city" couldn't have collapsed hundreds of meters via some large and sudden crustal movement because its structures are so well-preserved and seemingly in a pristine condition. (Assuming that you accept that it exists, and that the 3D representations of the city's sounding by side-scan sonar are accurate).
I completely disagree that "regular traffic" of horse-drawn carts could make such deep ruts in stone. I know that is the mainstream view, but it is absolutely preposterous.
Dr. Schock is anything but "unscientific". His willingness to risk his academic credibility and career in order to stay true the science of geology was amply demonstrated in the matter of the Sphinx enclosure. He made no friends in academia in that matter...but he became a favorite among alternative history reasearchers and enthusiasts.
Later, his expressed views that the Bosnian pyramid and the Yonaguni monument off the coast of Japan were natural formations angered the alternative people. Again, it appears that his primary goal was to follow the science as he saw it, regardless of who it might upset.
Perhaps he is incorrect in his assessments of the Bosnian site. I don't know. But being wrong does not make him unscientific.
According to this article, https://badarchaeology.wordpress.com/tag/paulina-zelitsky/, the team that discovered the city planned to make another expedition funded by National Geographic in 2005. I think it's possible that the Cuban government refused to allow further exploration of the site when it found that an American organization would be involved.
Years ago, I solved this but the Biblical Archaeology Society and others had no interest, as anything that affirms Scripture or hurts pre-existing sales is undesired. I can prove from early Christian writers and from the Bible itself that the Hebrew Exodus happened circa 1551 B.C., after Jacob entered there 215 years earlier, some 215 years after Abram did. Thus 430 years after Abraham entered Keme or Egypt, the Exodus happened. The significance of this is that the cited Sumerian king list ends in 1720 B.C.
The Sumerian king list: translation
Citing only in part:
1-39 After the kingship descended from heaven, the kingship was in Eridug. In Eridug, Alulim became king; he ruled for 28800 years. Alaljar ruled for 36000 years. 2 kings; they ruled for 64800 years. Then Eridug fell and the kingship was taken to Bad-tibira. In Bad-tibira, En-men-lu-ana ruled for 43200 years. En-men-gal-ana ruled for 28800 years. Dumuzid, the shepherd, ruled for 36000 years. 3 kings; they ruled for 108000 years. Then Bad-tibira fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Larag. In Larag, En-sipad-zid-ana ruled for 28800 years. 1 king; he ruled for 28800 years. Then Larag fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Zimbir. In Zimbir, En-men-dur-ana became king; he ruled for 21000 years. 1 king; he ruled for 21000 years. Then Zimbir fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Curuppag. In Curuppag, Ubara-Tutu became king; he ruled for 18600 years. 1 king; he ruled for 18600 years. In 5 cities 8 kings; they ruled for 241200 years. Then the flood swept over.
Black, J.A., Cunningham, G., Fluckiger-Hawker, E, Robson, E., and Zólyomi, G., The Electronic Text Corpus of Sumerian Literature (http://www-etcsl.orient.ox.ac.uk/), Oxford 1998- .
It seems that the proper word for "year", rather than a simple measure of time of an unknown factor, does not appear in the Akkadian chronology for it to be translated as "year" or such.
The word "year", not being a variant of sattu in the relevant texts below...are translated as to what appears to be an original intent of the scribe...an approximation of "days" is the logically correct translation...often in forms of one hundred as the measure of rounding up or down...based on reconstructing the corruption of the texts.
The chronology of the list of Sumerian kings is resolved by a better translation, reconstruction of corrupt texts to original intent, and a placing of that chronology upon the accuracy of the Biblical chronology.
1-39
After the kingship descended from heaven, 2348 B.C.
{after Noah’s ark}
the kingship was in Eridug.
The word for heaven, might easily be read as that which was first intended as waters from above...or, 'after that the [Noachian] flood receded". If this is the intent, there may have to be an adjustment to create a family (grandchildren and great grand-children) of Noah. This adjustment can be as little as 15 to as many as 50 years. All you need is a son of Shem intercoursing with two of his sisters or cousins for the clock to start ticking...if we were to take that approach. But the best we can do with the text, for now, is just a generalized reconstruction...until a better or comparative copy from antiquity surfaces.
In Eridug,
Alulim became king;
he ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years 10 months 2348 to 2269 B.C.
Alaljar ruled for 36000 {DAYS}. 98 years 6 months 2269 to 2171 B.C.
[some 22-30 years after 2269 B.C., the earth is divided]
2 kings; they ruled for 64800 {DAYS}. 177 years, 4 months -- ending 2171 B.C.
Then falling over to Eridug
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Bad-tibira.
In Bad-tibira, En-men-lu-ana ruled for 43200 {DAYS}. 118 years, 3 months 2348 to 2230 B.C.
En-men-gal-ana ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years 10 months -- 2230 to 2151 B.C.
Dumuzid, the shepherd, ruled for 36000 {DAYS}.
98 years, 6 months -- 2151 to 2053 B.C.
3 kings; they ruled for 108000 {DAYS}. 295 years, 7 months
Then falling over to Bad-tibira
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Larag.
In Larag, En-sipad-zid-ana ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years, 10 months -- 2053 to 1974 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years, 10 months
Then falling over to Larag
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Zimbir.
In Zimbir, En-men-dur-ana became king; he ruled for 21000 {DAYS}. 57 years, 6 months -- 1974 to 1917 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 21000 years. 57 years, 6 months
Then Zimbir fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Curuppag.
In Curuppag, Ubara-Tutu became king; he ruled for 18600 {DAYS} 50 years, 11 months -- 1917 to 1866 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 18600 years. 50 years, 11 months
In 5 cities 8 kings; they ruled for 241200 {DAYS}. 660 years, 3 months
However, the actual length breaks down to something like 482 years of existence, with 364 years of some kind of regional domination...both having their point of reference as ending 1866 B.C.
There may have to be some adjustment in the dating and translation regarding Eridug. The alternate scenario would have usregard the first de facto ruler as in 2230 B.C. as the date immediately following the fall of Babel, while dating Babel to within a decade of the Biblical expectancy.
"Then the flood swept over."
That is, here in this instance, "wiping the slate clean."
It is an expression of resoftening the clay, so that it can be reused for writing...or telling us that a new accounting, or sub-history, or of those with lesser titles, is taking place.
Therefore, we are next prepared for sub-kings, district lords, or first administrators of their provinces during the period following that up to this point. The Sumerian structure had essentially disintegrated by 1866 B.C., according to this timeline of the Sumerians, which dating is verified against the Bible timeline. But, like the vice-regent duality lists known to Manetho, who counted second in commands as if they too were Pharoahs…so also does this Sumerian account offer confusion in the number of what are reckoned as their own leaders. The list appears to be composed in or very shortly following 1720 B.C.
1866 - 1799 B.C.
(40-94) After the [same] flood [as listed above] had swept over, and the kingship had descended from heaven, the kingship was in Kic. In Kic, Jucur became king; he ruled for 1200 {DAYS}. etc.
... 23 kings; they ruled for 24510 {Days} ...Then Kic was defeated and the kingship was taken to E-ana. -- 67 years,1 month
...
1799 - 1793 B.C. / The Hyksos now invading Egypt, by my reconstruction of the Exodus timeline, textually provable by Greek history preserved by Patristics, and the Bible.
(95-133) In E-ana, Mec-ki-aj-gacer, the son of Utu, became lord and king; he ruled for 324 {Days}. etc.
...12 kings; they ruled for 2310 {Days}. Then Unug was defeated and the kingship was taken to Urim. -- 6 years, 4 months
...
(378-431) A total of 39 kings ruled for 14409 {Days}...in Kic.
That is, 39 years, 5 months or 1793 - 1754 B.C. in Kic.
A total of 22 kings ruled for 2610 {days}... in Unug.-- 7 years, 2 months or 1793 to 1786 B.C. in Unug
...A total of 134 kings, who altogether ruled for 28876 {days}
-- That is, 79 years or 1799 to 1720 B.C.
By this above reconstruction, edited down, we can see that the Akkadian / Old Babylonian / Sumerian vacuum was present in 1866 B.C.
If the Akkadians are any rule of measure to the Hittite issue...of the debate that sometimes arises as to precisely when the Hitites had their zenith in ancient history...we can say that the likelihood of the zenith of the Hittites was between 1866 B.C., to a point beyond 1720 B.C. on just the Sumerian texts alone.
With the Akkadian collapse, the uniting of bands in the Hittites would have allowed the prospering and dominance from the Lebanese Mediterranean Sea to the Euphrates river for hundreds of years, while being beyond the permanent logistically supported presence of an Egyptian army seeking to subjugate the same region.
Quote – A lot of it has it's origins in ancient Sumer and Egypt.”
Ya, I’ve heard all that baloney many times before, and it might fly with a majority of people, even Christians, who have not researched for themselves.
I have been researching this stuff for decades,a nd that will not fly with me.
Give me specofocs, and i’ll demolish anything you think you have anytime.
The days where you non believers can fake out the Christians are pretty mcuh over. We’re educated, we’ve done the YEARS of study and we know THE TRUTH. Those old tactics just won’t work anymore.
Show me specfics. any fool can blow-hard in generalities.
Indeed :) a great article with excellent information. There is also a find of ancient chinese mortar, using rice, either in the great wall of china or some other wall I cannot recall the documentary name or story. But I do remember reading about it late 2015. That chinese rice was mixed in, and it still has not diminished in bond strength.
Here you can navigate quickly through all comments made in any article sorted by date/time.
A lack of lines denotes a spiritual site? Why is that?
Yeah. Gotta love the complete inattention to how these were carved(inattention of the scientists, not the author of the article), since they only become visible for a few hours every decade or so...while simultaneously suggesting that they may be "centuries old". Last I checked, sea levels have supposedly been fairly stable since about 10k BC.
Cofferdams, maybe?
Wow. Some of those statues look a whole lot like the megalithic statues found in Sulawesi.
I agree, the reasons for the lack of follow-up on this is probably political. Too bad...I'd love to see some new imaging attempts, at least.
By the way, I thoroughly enjoyed this article as well. Your hypothesis is original and compelling, IMO.
Yeah? Who decides what is "extraordinary"?
We live within a universe that is in excess of 14,000,000,000 years old, on a planet that is about 4,000,000,000 years old, in a biosphere that has existed for up to 2,000,000,000 years; modern humans have been around for perhaps 250,000 years, though only 8,000 years of that is recorded history. Modern science has been around for 400 years or so, and current scientists have been here for 80-100 years tops, more like 40, on average.
So when they say "extraordinary", they base that on their experience of roughly %0.00032 of the sum total of humanity's period of existence, and about %0.00000004 of the timespan of life on earth.
A bit lacking in the credibility department in terms of being able to define what is or is not "extraordinary", don't you think?
Thanks for your comment! I'm glad you enjoyed the article.
I think the expanding earth theory is somewhat plausible. But shouldn't we be able to measure expansion if it is really happening? Do you know of any attempts to detect this expansion?
I think the discoverers of this underwater city just gave up trying to get funding for the follow-up expeditions and moved on with their lives...and since the city is in Cuban territorial waters, there's a lot of political red tape, especially if any Americans would be involved..
Thanks for you comment. Geologists would argue that these canyons could have been carved over millions of years by the erosive action of suspended sediments carried by the river as it flowed into the ocean...What do you think about this?
I'm not so sure about dinosaurs, but I would agree with you on there being lots of dead creatures!
Do you have any solid evidence that this is taking place? It seems like Google would be the last company to censor information in this manner unless there were military or government secrets involved.
Thanks for your comment. I believe the "city" couldn't have collapsed hundreds of meters via some large and sudden crustal movement because its structures are so well-preserved and seemingly in a pristine condition. (Assuming that you accept that it exists, and that the 3D representations of the city's sounding by side-scan sonar are accurate).
Hmm how about more information about the painter himself too? Maybe he knew things about Dee which were hidden?
I completely disagree that "regular traffic" of horse-drawn carts could make such deep ruts in stone. I know that is the mainstream view, but it is absolutely preposterous.
Dr. Schock is anything but "unscientific". His willingness to risk his academic credibility and career in order to stay true the science of geology was amply demonstrated in the matter of the Sphinx enclosure. He made no friends in academia in that matter...but he became a favorite among alternative history reasearchers and enthusiasts.
Later, his expressed views that the Bosnian pyramid and the Yonaguni monument off the coast of Japan were natural formations angered the alternative people. Again, it appears that his primary goal was to follow the science as he saw it, regardless of who it might upset.
Perhaps he is incorrect in his assessments of the Bosnian site. I don't know. But being wrong does not make him unscientific.
According to this article, https://badarchaeology.wordpress.com/tag/paulina-zelitsky/, the team that discovered the city planned to make another expedition funded by National Geographic in 2005. I think it's possible that the Cuban government refused to allow further exploration of the site when it found that an American organization would be involved.
The Bosnian Pyramids are a multi million dollar hoax.
In any case I'm not going to throw my money away there!
Years ago, I solved this but the Biblical Archaeology Society and others had no interest, as anything that affirms Scripture or hurts pre-existing sales is undesired. I can prove from early Christian writers and from the Bible itself that the Hebrew Exodus happened circa 1551 B.C., after Jacob entered there 215 years earlier, some 215 years after Abram did. Thus 430 years after Abraham entered Keme or Egypt, the Exodus happened. The significance of this is that the cited Sumerian king list ends in 1720 B.C.
The Sumerian king list: translation
Citing only in part:
1-39 After the kingship descended from heaven, the kingship was in Eridug. In Eridug, Alulim became king; he ruled for 28800 years. Alaljar ruled for 36000 years. 2 kings; they ruled for 64800 years. Then Eridug fell and the kingship was taken to Bad-tibira. In Bad-tibira, En-men-lu-ana ruled for 43200 years. En-men-gal-ana ruled for 28800 years. Dumuzid, the shepherd, ruled for 36000 years. 3 kings; they ruled for 108000 years. Then Bad-tibira fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Larag. In Larag, En-sipad-zid-ana ruled for 28800 years. 1 king; he ruled for 28800 years. Then Larag fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Zimbir. In Zimbir, En-men-dur-ana became king; he ruled for 21000 years. 1 king; he ruled for 21000 years. Then Zimbir fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Curuppag. In Curuppag, Ubara-Tutu became king; he ruled for 18600 years. 1 king; he ruled for 18600 years. In 5 cities 8 kings; they ruled for 241200 years. Then the flood swept over.
Black, J.A., Cunningham, G., Fluckiger-Hawker, E, Robson, E., and Zólyomi, G., The Electronic Text Corpus of Sumerian Literature (http://www-etcsl.orient.ox.ac.uk/), Oxford 1998- .
http://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/section2/tr211.htm
U le’u akannaka sattu gabbi - the scribe and the [engraved] record are there the entire year The Assyrian Dictionary (University of Chicago), p.157
http://oi.uchicago.edu/pdf/cad_tet.pdf
Sattisamma - year by year p.122
It seems that the proper word for "year", rather than a simple measure of time of an unknown factor, does not appear in the Akkadian chronology for it to be translated as "year" or such.
The word "year", not being a variant of sattu in the relevant texts below...are translated as to what appears to be an original intent of the scribe...an approximation of "days" is the logically correct translation...often in forms of one hundred as the measure of rounding up or down...based on reconstructing the corruption of the texts.
The chronology of the list of Sumerian kings is resolved by a better translation, reconstruction of corrupt texts to original intent, and a placing of that chronology upon the accuracy of the Biblical chronology.
1-39
After the kingship descended from heaven, 2348 B.C.
{after Noah’s ark}
the kingship was in Eridug.
The word for heaven, might easily be read as that which was first intended as waters from above...or, 'after that the [Noachian] flood receded". If this is the intent, there may have to be an adjustment to create a family (grandchildren and great grand-children) of Noah. This adjustment can be as little as 15 to as many as 50 years. All you need is a son of Shem intercoursing with two of his sisters or cousins for the clock to start ticking...if we were to take that approach. But the best we can do with the text, for now, is just a generalized reconstruction...until a better or comparative copy from antiquity surfaces.
In Eridug,
Alulim became king;
he ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years 10 months 2348 to 2269 B.C.
Alaljar ruled for 36000 {DAYS}. 98 years 6 months 2269 to 2171 B.C.
[some 22-30 years after 2269 B.C., the earth is divided]
2 kings; they ruled for 64800 {DAYS}. 177 years, 4 months -- ending 2171 B.C.
Then falling over to Eridug
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Bad-tibira.
In Bad-tibira, En-men-lu-ana ruled for 43200 {DAYS}. 118 years, 3 months 2348 to 2230 B.C.
En-men-gal-ana ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years 10 months -- 2230 to 2151 B.C.
Dumuzid, the shepherd, ruled for 36000 {DAYS}.
98 years, 6 months -- 2151 to 2053 B.C.
3 kings; they ruled for 108000 {DAYS}. 295 years, 7 months
Then falling over to Bad-tibira
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Larag.
In Larag, En-sipad-zid-ana ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years, 10 months -- 2053 to 1974 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 28800 {DAYS}. 78 years, 10 months
Then falling over to Larag
Taking (into account) the kingship (in regard to) Zimbir.
In Zimbir, En-men-dur-ana became king; he ruled for 21000 {DAYS}. 57 years, 6 months -- 1974 to 1917 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 21000 years. 57 years, 6 months
Then Zimbir fell (?) and the kingship was taken to Curuppag.
In Curuppag, Ubara-Tutu became king; he ruled for 18600 {DAYS} 50 years, 11 months -- 1917 to 1866 B.C.
1 king; he ruled for 18600 years. 50 years, 11 months
In 5 cities 8 kings; they ruled for 241200 {DAYS}. 660 years, 3 months
However, the actual length breaks down to something like 482 years of existence, with 364 years of some kind of regional domination...both having their point of reference as ending 1866 B.C.
There may have to be some adjustment in the dating and translation regarding Eridug. The alternate scenario would have usregard the first de facto ruler as in 2230 B.C. as the date immediately following the fall of Babel, while dating Babel to within a decade of the Biblical expectancy.
"Then the flood swept over."
That is, here in this instance, "wiping the slate clean."
It is an expression of resoftening the clay, so that it can be reused for writing...or telling us that a new accounting, or sub-history, or of those with lesser titles, is taking place.
Therefore, we are next prepared for sub-kings, district lords, or first administrators of their provinces during the period following that up to this point. The Sumerian structure had essentially disintegrated by 1866 B.C., according to this timeline of the Sumerians, which dating is verified against the Bible timeline. But, like the vice-regent duality lists known to Manetho, who counted second in commands as if they too were Pharoahs…so also does this Sumerian account offer confusion in the number of what are reckoned as their own leaders. The list appears to be composed in or very shortly following 1720 B.C.
1866 - 1799 B.C.
(40-94) After the [same] flood [as listed above] had swept over, and the kingship had descended from heaven, the kingship was in Kic. In Kic, Jucur became king; he ruled for 1200 {DAYS}. etc.
... 23 kings; they ruled for 24510 {Days} ...Then Kic was defeated and the kingship was taken to E-ana. -- 67 years,1 month
...
1799 - 1793 B.C. / The Hyksos now invading Egypt, by my reconstruction of the Exodus timeline, textually provable by Greek history preserved by Patristics, and the Bible.
(95-133) In E-ana, Mec-ki-aj-gacer, the son of Utu, became lord and king; he ruled for 324 {Days}. etc.
...12 kings; they ruled for 2310 {Days}. Then Unug was defeated and the kingship was taken to Urim. -- 6 years, 4 months
...
(378-431) A total of 39 kings ruled for 14409 {Days}...in Kic.
That is, 39 years, 5 months or 1793 - 1754 B.C. in Kic.
A total of 22 kings ruled for 2610 {days}... in Unug.-- 7 years, 2 months or 1793 to 1786 B.C. in Unug
...A total of 134 kings, who altogether ruled for 28876 {days}
-- That is, 79 years or 1799 to 1720 B.C.
By this above reconstruction, edited down, we can see that the Akkadian / Old Babylonian / Sumerian vacuum was present in 1866 B.C.
If the Akkadians are any rule of measure to the Hittite issue...of the debate that sometimes arises as to precisely when the Hitites had their zenith in ancient history...we can say that the likelihood of the zenith of the Hittites was between 1866 B.C., to a point beyond 1720 B.C. on just the Sumerian texts alone.
With the Akkadian collapse, the uniting of bands in the Hittites would have allowed the prospering and dominance from the Lebanese Mediterranean Sea to the Euphrates river for hundreds of years, while being beyond the permanent logistically supported presence of an Egyptian army seeking to subjugate the same region.
I’m not suire how that comment got here. It was posted in another article.
Well, we could see a LOT more of google wasn’t air-brushing out the ocean bottom on the satelite views. There must be something to hide.
Quote – A lot of it has it's origins in ancient Sumer and Egypt.”
Ya, I’ve heard all that baloney many times before, and it might fly with a majority of people, even Christians, who have not researched for themselves.
I have been researching this stuff for decades,a nd that will not fly with me.
Give me specofocs, and i’ll demolish anything you think you have anytime.
The days where you non believers can fake out the Christians are pretty mcuh over. We’re educated, we’ve done the YEARS of study and we know THE TRUTH. Those old tactics just won’t work anymore.
Show me specfics. any fool can blow-hard in generalities.
Jack
www.theliteralbible.com
Indeed :) a great article with excellent information. There is also a find of ancient chinese mortar, using rice, either in the great wall of china or some other wall I cannot recall the documentary name or story. But I do remember reading about it late 2015. That chinese rice was mixed in, and it still has not diminished in bond strength.
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