A manuscript illustration of the Sky Battle of Kurukshetra, fought between the Kauravas and the Pandavas, recorded in the Mahabharata Epic

Speakers at Science Congress says ancient India mastered advanced space flight thousands of years ago

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A controversial paper presented at the prestigious science conference, the 102nd Indian Science Congress in Mumbai, claims human aviation and advanced space flight was achieved and mastered by the ancient Indians, thousands of years before the Wright brothers in 1903.

The paper, presented by Captain Anand Bodas and Ameya Jadhav within a session titled Ancient Sciences through Sanskrit , details that in Vedic texts from 7,000 years ago, airplanes are described as being able to fly backwards and side-to-side. They could also shuttle between countries, continents and even planets.

Captain Anand J Bodas draws upon the ancient Vedas for evidence of aviation technology

Captain Anand J Bodas draws upon the ancient Vedas for evidence of aviation technology

“There is official history and unofficial history,” said Captain Bodas, according to TheNational. “Official history only noted that the Wright Brothers flew the first plane in 1903,” but the inventor of the airplane was really a sage named Bharadwaja, who lived around 7,000 years ago. “The ancient planes had 40 small engines.”

Painting of Bharadwaja, said to be one of the greatest Hindu sages

Painting of Bharadwaja, said to be one of the greatest Hindu sages. Public Domain

The Vedas are a large collection of Sanskrit texts originating in ancient India and constitute the oldest layer of Sanskrit literature and the oldest scriptures of Hinduism. Some of the collection, such as the Samhitas, are known to date back to at least 1,700 B.C., although it is believed that many go back much further.

An illustration of the Shakuna Vimana that is supposed to fly like a bird with hinged wings and tail.

An illustration of the Shakuna Vimana that is supposed to fly like a bird with hinged wings and tail. Public Domain

The subject of ‘flying machines’ has been a popular subject among ancient astronaut theorists, who argue that some extracts are evidence of extra-terrestrial visitations:

“The Pushpaka (flowery vimana) chariot that resembles the Sun and belongs to my brother was brought by the powerful Ravana; that aerial and excellent chariot going everywhere at will… that chariot resembling a bright cloud in the sky... and the King (Rama) got in, and the excellent chariot at the command of the Raghira, rose up into the higher atmosphere.” (Ramayana)

However, Captain Bodas said that ancient Indians invented the technology and that it was later forgotten because of the passage of time, foreign rulers and things being stolen from the country.

The Times of India reports that the paper, presented at the conference which included six Nobel laureates and award winning academics and scientists in its roster, has been met with skepticism, claims of “pseudo-science,” and the argument that the theory undermines empirical evidence by citing ancient religious texts.

The Indian Science Congress Association (ISCA) is a premier scientific organization of India, with more than 30,000 scientist members. The ISCA’s mandate is to publish journals, hold conferences and advance and promote the cause of science.

Valedictory Session of the 100th Indian Science Congress in Kolkata

Valedictory Session of the 100th Indian Science Congress in Kolkata ( Wikimedia Commons )

NASA scientist Dr. Ram Prasad Gandhiraman started an online petition before the conference was held to oppose certain lectures which were thought to advance a mix of science, mythology and the politics of Hindu nationalists.

However others, such as an Indian scientist from the U.S. who attended the conference, seemed to find the examination of ancient testimony compelling, saying, “Knowledge always grows, its flow never stops. So if all this knowledge was available in the ancient days, I need to know where it stopped. Why did it fail to grow? Why was there no advancement? When did it stop? I am not aware of the chronology of events, but I am definitely willing to learn more and find out.”

Featured Image: A manuscript illustration of the Sky Battle of Kurukshetra, fought between the Kauravas and the Pandavas, recorded in the Mahabharata Epic ( Wikimedia Commons )

By Liz Leafloor

Comments

I have said Amartya Sen was given the Nobel Prize as a substitute for me ( see my blog “How India’s Economy Can Grow 30% Per Year Or More : HowIndiasEconomyCanGrowDOTblogspotDOTcom ) so he is now returning the favor by saying Indians learned mathematics from the Greeks, etc., though Indian civilization is much older and everything the Greeks knew they got from India.

@SATISH CHANDRA
Such utter nonsense. There is 0,00000000 % proof in this entire article, Indian archaeological sites, and no real evidence of machinery found. To make matters worse, stories are made from religious texts!

Again these are exaggerated stories from people with (primarily) Indian background, only investigating their own history and not those from other regions in the world.
That's why such ridiculous claims are made. I'll tell you why:

2). To start: Turkey(Anatolia), Greece, Greek Island of Cyprus, Levant region, has a much older life span of civilization.
In Turkey alone (which was less than 600 years ago, Greek, just like Pakistan now with India) every year many 4000-10000 BC cities and sites are found.
Turkey holds the oldest temple in the world (10.000 BC) and Catalhoyuk (7000 BC) the largest and best preserved neolithic city in the world.
Next to this Greece and Turkey hold the most archaeological sites in the world.
-News from today for instance: A new palace from 4500 BC: http://archaeologynewsnetwork.blogspot.nl/2014/09/chalcolithic-palace-un...(The+Archaeology+News+Network)

I will show you a few examples why Greece holds one of the most incredible and oldest history in the world, with many firsts:

1). THE OLDEST WRITING IN THE WORLD. GREEK ALPHABET WAS IN USE IN 6000 BC PREDATING INDIAN, EGYPT, MESOPOTAMIA WRITING, BY 3000-3500 YEARS.
The oldest writing found on the planet is the DISPILIO TABLET in Greece. Which dates to 5300 BC. Found in the lake of Kastoria in Greece (found in1993), called
the Dispilio tablet with the first linear writing from 5300BC pre-dating Egyptian, Indian and Sumerian writings by 2300 to 3000 years.
http://archaeologynewsnetwork.blogspot.nl/2012/07/prehistorc-tablet-call...
http://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-europe/dispilio-tablet-old...
http://greece.greekreporter.com/2012/07/16/7270-year-old-tablet-found-in...

These Linear writings are SIMILAR to the writings of today. In other words the GREEK ALPHABET was in use 6000BC, as ALL European languages are Linear(alphabetical) writings

(Among Dispilio and other around this date) Another amazing finds are the YURA potteries in Central Greece. These contain again even older than the Dispilio writings from 5500-6000BC. MORE IMPORTANTLY. The postsherds contains letters of the Greek alphabet, that is in use today. Making it the oldest in use language in the world
http://www.hellinon.net/NeesSelides/greek_alphabet_was_in_use_at_600.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youra_Potsherds
http://newsarc.net/showthread.php/soc.history.ancient/Greek%20Alphabet%2...
These predating for example earliest Indian writing by over 3000-4000 years.
These Yura Potteries together with the Displilio tablet are the oldest writings on earth.
These Archaeological finds will change the history of the world

This extremely old writings fit the following finding that archaeologists have done for the last 4 years. For they found an incredibly advanced 8000 year old civilisation that had buildings and multi storey houses. Which can be seen as the forefather of the incredibly advanced Minoan civilization from 3650 BC - 1300 BC.

2).NEW REMARKABLY 8000 YEAR OLD ADVANCED CIVILIZATION FOUND IN 2013-2014, GREECE (6000BC)
"The discovery reflects an incredibly advanced civilization existing in northern Greece 8,000 years ago." (Already 54 settlements have been discovered)
http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-history-archaeology/accidental-disco...

3). RICHEST LANGUAGE IN THE WORLD WITH 5 MILLION WORDS GREEK LANGUAGE
Another fun fact: even the world map, ALL the words are Greek.
Even the names of the countries India, Asia, Europa, Phillipines or Atlantic ocean and thousands of words are Greek.
Example: Even the islands of Polynesia and Micronesia
(Poly=is many - nesia = Islands). So polynesia = many islands
Micro=small - nesia = Islands. So micronesia = small islands
Ego(Egoist) = ME or I in greek. Or Philosophy, or Pediatrician(Pedia=kids)
or gynecologist (gyneca=wife/female).And tens of thousands of other words are all Greek.

Richest language in the world stated even by Guinness book of Records
http://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2010/09/with-five-million-words-greek-is...
http://www.explorers-journal.com/we-all-speak-greek/

And the 60+ settlements, cities,villages of 8000 years ago fits with the 7300 year old Dispilio tablet writing and the 8000 year old Yura potteries writings.
And these fit within the next things:

4). PAVLOPETRI, THE OLDEST SUNKEN CITY IN THE WORLD, WITH INCREDIBLE URBAN CITY PLANNING THAT MATCHES AND EXCEEDS THAT OF SOME CITIES TODAY. THE CITY IS AT LEAST 5000 YEARS OLD.
THERE ARE FEW OLDER SUNKEN SITES IN THE WORLD BUT NONE CAN BE CONSIDERED TO BE PLANNED CITIES SUCH AS THIS, WHICH IS WHY IT IS UNIQUE.
Greece has a coastline of 16.000 km.
60% of all cities in Greece today, have been found close to the sea.
Greece's geography is very diverse with 6000 islands and diverse mainland. There have already been found many cities in the sea such as Pavlopetri (5000+ year old) which is the oldest submerged archeological town site in the world, complete with incredibly advanced urban planning compared to and even better than some cities today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavlopetri
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-15191614

5). OLDEST GOLDSMITHING IN THE WORLD
Or the oldest gold smithing in the world over 4600-4200BC in South Bulgaria/Greece. http://www.pacmusee.qc.ca/en/exhibitions/varna-worlds-first-gold-ancient...
http://ancientstandard.com/2007/08/02/gold-of-the-dead-ca-4600-%E2%80%93...

6).INCREDIBLY ADVANCED MINOAN CIVILIZATION (3750-1400BC) PALACES AND CITIES WITH SEWERAGES, URBAN PLANNING, PLUMBING SYSTEMS AND TOILETS IN EVERY HOUSE
Prior to Mycenean and Classical Greece, there where the Aegean civilization and in Crete there was the famed Minoan civilization who was incredibly advanced for it’s time(3750-1400BC). They had many cities and palaces with sewerage systems, plumbing systems, urban planning, with toilets for every common house, even on the 3rd floor. With palaces of 5 to 7 floors high.with complex architecture to withstand earthquakes. They had complex society, beautiful art and writings.This is where the stories of Atlantis come from.
http://www.minoanatlantis.com/pix/Minoan_Knossos_Palace_Reconstruction_1...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b2/Akrotiri_ship-process... paintings
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ea/Knossos_-_North_Porti... palace
http://ant3145crete.wikispaces.com/file/view/Knossos_1.jpg/68392549/Knos... palace
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d3/Disque_de_Phaistos_A.jpg
http://kbagdanov.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/min-1.jpg palaces
http://www.dartmouth.edu/~prehistory/aegean/wp-content/flagallery/lesson... 3 storey houses
http://fashionhistory.zeesonlinespace.net/images/minoan1.gif paintings
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/originals/63/8b/40/638b40712476ee7928d...
http://www.pinterest.com/pin/515169644846367611/
http://classconnection.s3.amazonaws.com/305/flashcards/873305/png/crete1...
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/img_fullsize/65187.jpg

7). PETRALONA MAN 800.000 BC -700.000 BC (Oldest human found in Europe), Greece
http://www.ancient-origins.net/human-origins-science/human-skull-challen...

8). OLDEST USE OF FIRE IN THE WORLD 700.000 BC, Greece
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petralona_cave

9). OLDEST SEA NAVIGATION IN THE WORLD, GREECE 130.000 BC,
http://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-technology/ancient-navigation-130...

10). OLDEST SWASTIKA'S IN THE WORLD IN THE BALKANS
But this is not my point. My point is that you or some other Indians believe that the whole world is credited to the Indians. But that is completely the biggest nonsense in the world. Even India's most holy symbol the Swastika, where Indians so called believe they created it, is not even theirs:
The oldest swastika found in the world is in Ukraine 10.000BC.
http://www.slavorum.com/forum/index.php?topic=1856.0
-Then Vinca culture in Balkans(Greece, Bulgaria etc) used the swastika continuously from 6500BC for over 2000 years long. The oldest ever found swastika in India is from 2500BC. The swastika is even used in the Vinca script of 7000-6000BC, which predates Indus valley script (2600-1900BC) by 4000-5000 years.
http://aleximreh.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/swastika-in-the-vinca-script-6...

11). THEOPETRA, KALAMBAKA, Greece 130.000 BC
With Oldest man made wall (25.000 BC) on the planet
http://visitmeteora.wordpress.com/2013/02/08/theopetra-cave-inhabited-by...

12). FRANCHTHI 25.000 BC, Greece
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/6d/a6/0e/6da60eb609f0eab8d070086d...

13). KLIMONAS 9100 BC, Greek island of Cyprus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klimonas

14). SHILLOUROKAMBOS 8500 BC, Greek island of Cyprus
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/64/99/5f/64995fe79103a63592b9c240...

15). KHIROKITIA 7000BC,Greek island of Cyprus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khirokitia
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/8c/84/30/8c84303d1d2e038e294...

16). SESKLO 6850 BC (among 60 settlements from 7th–8th millennium BC), Greece
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/2a/bb/a3/2abba385155e17d7264...

17). DIKILI TASH 6500BC, WITH 6200 YEAR OLD WINE MAKING, North Greece
Winemaking of 6200 year old
http://archaeology.about.com/od/dterms/qt/Dikili-Tash.htm

18). PYRAMID, ARGOS, GREECE 2720BC
http://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-europe/pyramid-argos-greec...

19). MAKRIYIALOS, 5500 BC, Greece
http://www.ime.gr/chronos/01/images/gallery/nl/makryg/makrig2.gif

20). DISPILIO 5300BC - 4500BC Kastoria, Greece
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/4c/c7/6e/4cc76eb933c14ef0145...

21). DIMINI 4800 BC, With earliest fortifications 3400 BC, Greece
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimini
http://www.figurines.gr/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/dimini_anaktoro1.jpg

22). NEA NIKOMEDEIA, 6700 BC, Greece
http://www.elinos.gr/images/area1.jpg

23). MAROULAS, KYTHNOS, 9500 BC, Greece
http://www.kythnos.gr/en/content/history/100-centuries/
http://www.kythnos.gr/images/history/Xerolithies3.JPG
https://www.gtp.gr/MGfiles/location/image14717[7343].jpg

24). Sitagroi, 5500 BC, Greece
http://www.ime.gr/chronos/02/mainland/images/eh/habitation/max/sitagr.gif
http://www.sitagroi-dramas.gr/data/storage/attachments/f40f757947675221d...

25). ARGISSA 6600 BC, Greece
http://sup.kathimerini.gr/kath/engs/img/LIFE/2011/01/greecesrich.jpg

26). MAVROPIGI, 7660 BC, Greece
http://antiquity.ac.uk/projgall/mentessidi336/images/figure3big.jpg
http://e-ptolemeos.gr/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ANASKAFI-MAVROPIGI.jpg

27). Phaestos, Crete, 4000 BC, Greece
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phaistos
http://www.dartmouth.edu/~prehistory/aegean/wp-content/flagallery/lesson...
http://www.greek-islands.us/heraklio/knossos/Phaistos-Palace.jpg
http://www.greeceathensaegeaninfo.com/a-greece-travel/a-maps/crete-phais...

28). -KALAMAKIA, Greece 80.000 BC,
- LAKONIS, Greece 100.000 BC, http://www.amna.gr/english/articleview.php?id=2773
- APIDIMA,Greece 300.000 BC,
- Alonnisos Greece, 120.000 BC,
- Ochre mines, Thasos, Greece 20.300 BC
- Piges tou Angiti, Greece 30.000 BC
- Kleidi, Epirus, Greece 16.000 BC
- Boila, Epirus, Greece 14.000 BC

29). SKARKOS 3000 BC, Ios, Greece
http://www.thebestinheritage.com/Files/images/presentations/2009/P_04_sk...
http://www.thebestinheritage.com/files/Images/presentations/2009/P_04_sk...
http://www.thebestinheritage.com/presentations/2009/xxi-ephorate-of-preh...

30). Agios Andreas, Sifnos, Greece
http://mysifnos.gr/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/%CE%91%CE%BA%CF%81%CF%8C%C...
http://eparxiakofos.gr/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/11.jpg
http://eparxiakofos.gr/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/10.jpg

31). Kalavasos Tenta 7000 BC
http://www.cyprushighlights.com/en/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/0212.jpg
http://ips-static.videopublishing.com/kyproscom/Cyprus_Larnaka_Tenta_Kal...
http://agrino.org/nicosia/072.jpg
http://www.oocities.org/marcandkaren2004/cyprus/cyTenta7H350W577_28k.JPG

31). Akrotiri-Aetokremnos 10.500 BC
Promachonas, 5300 BC
Aravissos, 4500 BC
Rachmani 4500 BC
Ayia Varvara Asprokremnos 9000 BC
Soufli Magoul 6500 BC
Ayia Sophia, Larisa, 4500 BC
Ayios Georgios, 6500-5800BC
Magoula Asimochoma 5300 BC
Platia Magoula Zarkou 5300 BC
Prodromos, Karditsa 6500 BC
Tzani Magoula 5800 BC
Ais Yiorkis 7800 BC
Magoula Visviki 5300 BC
Magoula Karamourlar 6500 BC
Kataliondas- Kourvellos 8000 BC
Magoula Sarantaporo 5800 BC
Lianokladi, Phthiotis 5800 BC
Aria, Argolid 4500 BC
Ayia Marina, Phocis 5300 BC
Lerna 5800 BC
Sphakovouni, Arcadia 4500 BC
Ayios Dimitrios, Triphylia 4500 BC
Myrina, Lemnos 5300 BC
Saliagos 5300 BC
Yiali, Nisyros 4500 BC

Sotira 5000 BC
Ierapetra 5800 BC

- And many many more, Mitrou, Knossos, Achilleion, paradimi, Youra, Saliagos, Melos, Asea, Nemea, Corinth, Boeotia, Kitsos, Kephala, Eutretis, Elateia, Halai, Choirospillia, Otzaki, , Zarkou, Tsangly, Diros, Priniatikos Pyrgos, Kastros, Loutro, Kephala, Malia, ,Phylakopi Akrotiri, Sifnos, Agia Irini, Panormos, Kissonerga, Kavos Daskaleiou, Minoa, Keros, Strofilas, Psiloritis, ETC, Ranging from 11th millennium 3rd millennium BC

32). Linear B WRITING, OLDER THAN PREVIOUSLY BELIEVED, 1500 BC, GREECE
Also Linear B which derives from Linear A, is also older than presently thought. As there have been findings in 2011 that concludes that Linear B now is at least from 1500 BC
http://www.aegeanscripts.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=artic...
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/03/110330-oldest-writing-eu...

Cretan Hyroglyphic, 2100-1700 BC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_hieroglyphs

Linear A, 1900-1450 BC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_A

INDIA HAS SOME OLD ARCHAEOLOGICAL SITES TOO
And yes, India is also old. So far these are among the oldest things they have found from neolithic times India:

-The oldest farm village in India found, Merhrgarh, 7000-5500 BC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mehrgarh

-Neolithic Edakkal caves, 6000 BC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edakkal_Caves

-Bhimbetka rockshelters, 10.000 BC - 2.500 BC
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/india/central_india/bhimbetka.php

Even though India's oldest archaeological sites are not nearly as old or abundance, as for instance Levant, Greece and Anatolia, it still shows clear signs of human civilization in the case of Mehrgarh. Next to this, most of the oldest (Neolithic) archaeological sites in India are caves and rockshelters. While from the same time period in Greece alone there are over a 1000+ neolithic sites from 10.000 BC - 4000 BC

-THE CASE OF DWARKA
And in case of the sunken city of Dwarka. As great as it may sound a sunken city of 12.000 years old, the real archaeologists on earth(Including in India) are not so sure. Nothing is really proven. even some of the oldest things that archaeologists found , where tree branches, from 8500 year old that where actually coming from the Arabian peninsula. Archaeologists believe that these branches can NOT indicate the date of this city, as these tree branches could have been washed against this archaeological site.
The city could be 1000 BC, but because a 8500 year old tree branch might have ended up floating there, does not make this city going from 1000 BC to 6500 BC.
I'm not saying it isn't old, but there is no evidence of supporting this city of being 12.000 years.

-Bronze Age (Indus)
I am well aware of the bronze age civilization from India, (Indus) which is similarly old as the bronze age civilization from for instance Greece (Minoan civilisation 3650 BC-1170 BC, Helladic civilisation 3300BC-1050BC and Cycladic civilisation 3300-1400BC). But we are now talking about civilizations even older than that. And that is were Turkey, Greece, Levant region, holds much older and much more Archaeological sites than India from neolithic and mesolithic times. Every week a new great 4000-10.0000+ archaeological site is being found in these regions.

Idiot. The oldest civilization is Indian civilization. Vimanas are fact ancient Indians flew Aircrafts. Discovery in 1992 has proved Indian civilization is the oldest and the most advanced thatbis 54000 years old. Krishna was born 32000 years ago. U will not accept it because Indians have a brown skin.u whites have always envied India and are always jealous of India's accomplishments.

And about influences. It's exactly the opposite from what you claim without any facts.

While both in Ancient Greek and ancient Indian literature it shows that they where not well aware of eachother and not in contact with eachother in Ancient times due to the large achaemenid empire in between. Only after Alexander had the ancient world around its finger was there true contact when Greeks spread hellenization across the ancient world. Ancient Greece had immense inlfuence on civilization across the ancient world and had immense influences also in Central Asia and the Indian subcontinent

1).INDIA'S BUDDHA FIRST MADE BY GREEKS
Not to forget that Ancient Greece, profoundly influenced central Asia and India, through Greco- Bactrian Kingdom that existed 400 years long. As Ancient Greece has Sculptures, architecture, Jewelry, Art, Theatre that was unrivaled to anywhere in the world, this resulted in the great transmission of Greek knowledge to Central Asia and India. Examples are:

The first buddha's made by Greeks:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Buddhism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Buddhist_art

FACT: Images, findings and datings show that first Indian buddha's where made in Greek Hellenic Style. For 1000 years the Buddha was made in Greek style, with Greek sculpting technology all across India.

2).GREEKS INVENTED AND BROUGHT THEATER TO CENTRAL ASIA AND INDIA.
Also. Have you ever wondered why India's theater started after Alexander the great entered India and who had a kingdom for 400 year in Bactria (afghanistan/pakistan).
Quote: "The earliest form of the theatre of India was the Sanskrit theatre.[1] It began after the development of Greek and Roman theatre and before the development of theatre in other parts of Asia."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theatre_of_India

3). GREEK ARCHITECTURE, JEWELRY, SCULPTURES WE UNRIVALED IN ALL OF ANCIENT WORLD
And when you go to the exhibition of Alexander the Great, you notice that Greek architecture, jewelry, and sculpture was unrivaled to anywhere in the world. Also where  ancient Greek jewelry was super refined, the Indian jewelry was thick, simplistic and unrefined.
http://c300221.r21.cf1.rackcdn.com/laocoon-and-his-sons-1348967845_org.jpg
http://www.greek-thesaurus.gr/images/p7/hairnet.JPG
http://www.pinterest.com/pin/145593000427091453/
http://www.pinterest.com/pin/515169644846354380/
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m82bvcxdIz1rufkgxo1_1280.jpg
Only after the influence of Ancient Greece, and it's Greco-Bactrian Kingdom for 400 years, the jewelry, sculpting and many other crafts, of which Greeks where masters at, where transmitted to the peoples of Central Asia and India. This is also easy to attest. Go look for Ancient sculptures, jewelry, Architecture, in the region before Ancient Greece Influenced the region, and then after the 400 year of Hellenization of the region.

4). UNPARALELLED GREEK ASTRONOMY THAT INFLUENCED THE ENTIRE WORLD,
The same applies to Indian Astronomy, that was influenced with the rise of the Greek culture in the east.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_astronomy
"For example, Hellenistic astronomy is known to have been practiced near India in the Greco-Bactrian city of Ai-Khanoum from the 3rd century BCE. Various sun-dials, including an equatorial sundial adjusted to the latitude of Ujjain have been found in archaeological excavations there.Numerous interactions with the Mauryan Empire, and the later expansion of the Indo-Greeks into India suggest that transmission of Greek astronomical ideas to India occurred during this period"

4.1). FIRST COMPUTER IN THE WORLD: ANTIKYTHERA.
Greek mathematics was so advanced, that they build the first computer in the world to measure the distance and movements from the stars. The antikythera, is heralded as the world's most advanced ancient technology. Not to be seen anywhere else in the world until 1600 AD in Europe.

http://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-technology/incredible-inner-worki...
The first computer in the world and most complex piece of technical engineering, unheard of anywhere in the ancient world, to invention of musical notation, that we use today. Or to to first robotics, Pneumatism, to the invention of the steam engine, automatic doors, elevators, steam cannon, to hydraulics, Automata, Mechanica, Catoptrica, Stereometrica,  (heron of Alexandria), the first cookbook, astrolabe. Or even vending machines and washstands, where people could throw a coin in so that people could wash their hands or get food from the machine. Things that are unheard of to anywhere in the world and only to be re-invented in 18-19th century. Or to clock towers, alarm clocks, showers, central heating, railways,levers, inextinguishable Greek fire, the coinage system, cartography, lighthouses, anthropology,humanism, oldest composed musical piece in the world (Seikilos Epitaph), and really I could go on and on and on.

5). CHINESE, CENTRAL ASIANS WHERE DEEPLY INSPIRED BY GREEK SCULPTURES
Not only that. Greece spread Hellenism into Central Asia including Indian subcontinent. And for 400 years Greece has influenced the entire region heavily. Even china's terracotta army was inspired by Greek statues, as they are unrivaled in the world. And india's art, theatre, democracy, architecture, jewelry, was completely influenced by Ancient Greece. Basically Ancient Greek Arts and sciences influenced the whole ancient world
http://www.livescience.com/41828-terracotta-warriors-inspired-by-greek-a...

6). GREEK COINAGE INFLUENCED CENTRAL ASIA AND INDIA HEAVILY
The Indians learnt much from the Greco-Bactrian Kingdom in the field of numismatics.
The Bactrian coins improved the Indian coinage to a large extent. The punch marked crude coins of India were replaced by regular better shaped coins. The Greek word "drachma" was adopted by the Indians as Dramma.
Even Saka and Pahalava coins on silver and copper follow the reduced Greco-Bactrian standard.
- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy_of_the_Indo-Greeks#Influence_of_Indo...
- http://books.google.nl/books?id=0UA4rkm9MgkC&pg=PA102&lpg=PA102&dq=Greek...

- http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Apollodotosi.jpg
- http://www.iranicaonline.org/img/ot_grp10/khalchayan_fig_2.jpg
- http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/40/EucratidesState...
- http://education-portal.com/cimages/multimages/16/met_greek_hellenistic_...
- http://www.ancientgoldcoins.com/images/Ptolemaic-Arsinoe-II.jpg
http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/greece/baktria/kings/demetrios/SNGANS_187...

6.1) Coinage system was invented by the Greek state Lydia and on the Greek island Aegina in 700 BC. Everywhere where Greek civilization went, the introduction of coinage followed. All over ancient Greece spanning from Sicily, Mediterranean to the black sea, and soon after introducted to Persia in 500 BC, and India 300-330 BC. China had a standardized coinage system in 200BC
- http://www.ancient.eu/coinage/
- https://www.google.nl/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&u...
- http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p72/wetew_photo/650bc.gif

7). Even today India is a democracy(Also Greek), and ironically the only language in the whole of India that connects all groups and peoples is the English language. Which has become the dominant language. Did you know that 60.000 English words are Greek of Origin?
Also did you know that India's economy is completely based on western system, that originates from Ancient Greece?

Not only that. If you say "Asia" it's a Greek word. If you say telephone, its Greek. even the name India is Greek:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_India
Greece's influence is the foundation of many things in the world for a reason. Your economy, laws, democracy, even your theater, art, etc originated from the influences of Greece. Even china's terracotta army, just like Indian sculptures,jewelry, architecture was influences because of Ancient Greece.

8). Greece had a immense influence on Indian Rock cutting techniques, for temples, rock cutting caves etc. And basically 99% of all temples in India comes way after the the time of ancient Greece. Most are dated after 10th century AD till 18th Century AD.
"
Buddhism gained prominence during the reign of the emperor Ashoka. It is primarily represented by three important building types- the Chaitya Hall (place of worship), the Vihara (monastery) and the Stupa (hemispherical mound for worship/ memory)- exemplified by the magnificent caves of Ajanta and Ellora and the monumental Sanchi Stupa. The Greek influence led the Indian architecture of the time, especially the rock-cut art, to fall under one of the two categories: the Mathura school of art which was strictly Indian in spirit and did not adopt from the Greek styles, and the Gandharva school of art which incorporated influences of the Greek art.
http://www.crystalinks.com/indiarchitecture.html
"

And then I haven't covered many topics up to the influence of Ancient Greece on the Sari of India.

These are but a few examples, that show that Greece the most advanced technological civilization, had 400 years of direct influence on India.If Greece didn't influence India, then India would not be the same today.

Tsurugi's picture

You're missing the point. First of all, all that "oldest this" and "oldest that" you listed is actually "oldest known", which is vastly different. A lot of archaeology has been done in Greece. Very little has been done in India, which is also immense in size.
Greece certainly had an influence on India, but if there was an advanced civilization in India it would necessarily have been in deep antiquity, far before the classical Grecian culture emerged.

Also, don't forget that Greece was heavily influenced by the culture of Egypt, which vastly antedated that of Greece. This is attested to many times in the writings of Greek philosophers, who were far humbler men than yourself, it seems.

You are missing also the same point you where making. The period ancient Greece (800-200BC, has been the greatest focuspoint of archaeologists all across the world within Greece.
Only for the 20 years, did the focus shift to other much older era's where archaeologists have examples of incredibly old civilization, that we now are starting to talk for instance about an 8000 year old civilization in Central Greece that had remarkably advanced architecture for the time and multiple finds by now of writing dated to 8000,7300 and 7000 year ago, not to forget. With over a thousand archaeological sites dated to before 4000BC, of which most have been found in the last 10 years.

Even in the case of the 8000 year old civilization with where they found 60+ cities,villages,settlements over 24 have been found just in the last 2 years. What does this say? This says that in Greece, as well as Anatolia(presentday Turkey) there is a constant stream of incredible finds from all era's of human civilization from the dawn of human civilization 12.000 years ago till presentday.  
And the same in the bronze age with the Minoan civilization(3650BC-1300BC) which had incredible art,palaces, cities with all of them multistorey houses each with flushtoilets, urban planning, sewerage systems, architecture that withstood earthquakes, roads, etc, is but an example of that is was one of the most advanced bronze age civilizations on the planet. These are but example of much older civilization in Greece. 

You don't have to find me humble. Which is certainly not my intention with this post, It is to make aware.
I only write down what has been found, not like some exaggerating indian who claim that one of their gods are 160 million years old, and thus their civilization is 160 million years old, or that that the sunken city of Dwarka stories by some have been exaggerated to 7000, 8000 then 12000 and then 30.000 years old based on story telling, while in reality Dwaraka has been dated and internationally accepted to 1500BC. The oldest find they made was a tree branch that comes from the forest of the Arabian peninsula of 8500 years ago, into the strong currents of the Gulf of Ghambat.
Based on this branch, that most scientists believe floated to the strong currents of Ghambat bay, is apparently enough for some people to make incredible assumptions that the city is 8000, 12000 and then 30.000 years ago.

So it's fine you say you find my post not humble, I merely react on what you can call Bollywood storystelling, with immense exaggeration without facts to support, really.
I rather be someone who understands and works with proof, evidence, archaeological sites, linguistic evidence, than believing evergrowing stories, religious texts (in most cases well after AD),  and images that are dated to much much much later that show flying horses,ponys and animals than the period they are actually fantazing about. I might as well start use the bible as proof!
 

Tsurugi's picture

The point you are missing is the very fact that Greece has been under so much heavy scrutinty by archaeologists for so long, while India has not. India is also vast, and even so it is known to be covered in innumerable ruins and magnificent temples and edifices, some of which defy belief, like the rock-cut temples or the stepwells. Few of these have really been studied by archaeology, and much of it is dated by asssociation and assumption. And no one has much bothered to search for hidden sites, since there are so many in plain view.

As for Dwarka, I can only say, you have not done your research, sir. So you fall back on the concensus of mainstream archaeology, which is sort of amusing, all things considered.

I don't actually have any problem with you being proud of the Greecian past. It is something to be proud of, for sure. But it is possible to be proud of one's history without denigrating the history of others. The greatness of Greece's past does not need to step on that of India to stand tall, because it stands tall on its own. Your belittling comparisons do not make Grecian history loom larger, they only make you yourself appear smaller.

First of all, there is nothing belitteling about what I say. I point out unsolved puzzles that are claimed by some as truth.  
Just like massive floating buildings, with 2 little wings that could fly front to back, left to right and to other countries and even planets. When one takes that and even presents it as proof, then who are you to judge me on saying that I cannot express my opinion on that there is 0% proof of this. Because really, there is no proof. And on top of that, these same people then saying how they invented everything, with again 0% facts to prove, is the only comical attraction here.

And about Dwarka. you know something that I don't know? well show me facts and information then. It's that simple. Same goes for Vimana's show me info then.  So keep on dating by association and assumption, but the facts out there now, that are internationally accepted, say a whole different deal about many things. Show me 30.000 year of dwarka civilization, show me vimana proof. No? Then don't blame me by asking logical questions. "yeeaaah but but excuse this, and excuse that, and India has no archaeologists ".
Really, how do you know how much there still lies in wait in both regions. It is implying asif  Greece (and Turkey for that matter) is nearing archaeological completion, while really there has never been found more ancient sites in both Greece, Turkey and India than ever before in the last 20 years. due to technologies that where not present before. Stop giving irrelevant excuses, in which you don't know what the truth is.

1).Just like the vimana's storytelling that are based on a 1930 Indian book written by a man thousands of years later, completely out of context and own interpretation. Above that it was never mentioned in the earliest religious texts and when it was mentioned in later religious texts, the vimana's where still a horse with a carriage on the ground.
That's is something completely different from these "fllying buildings that could travel to the stars".  There is a strong difference between fiction and true evidence/what has been found to date.

http://ancientaliensdebunked.com/references-and-transcripts/vimanas/

For the Vimana's are completely torn out of context and in the earliest religous texts, they where never mentioned. 

2).And an Indian NASA scientist even launched a petition where he states that the talk at the science congress is pseudo-science, which represents nothing but myths and lies, and demands that the talk is cancelled.

Controversy
The 102nd Indian Science Congress to be held at the Mumbai University in January 2015 is scheduled to have a session on "ancient sciences through Sanskrit" in which a presentation on Vaimānika Śāstra is included. It is slated to be delivered by Captain Anand J. Bodas, a pilot, and Ameya Jadhav, who holds in a M.A. in Sanskrit as well as an M.Tech. degree. Captain Bodas, speaking to the news media, has said that the aeroplanes of Vedic times could fly not only from country to country, but also "from planet to planet." "In those days, aeroplanes were huge in size, and could move left, right, as well as backwards, unlike modern planes which only fly forward," he added. Ram Prasad Gandhiraman, a NASA scientist, has launched an on-line petition demanding that the talk be cancelled as it represents pseudo-science.[10][11] 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaim%C4%81nika_Sh%C4%81stra

3). Really, if you could be the one that could provide me even 1% evidence of what some people are claiming, then I would be the last one to say "nonsense it's not true".
If not, then not only do I keep seeing this as false and nonsense, also is it even worse for some Indians, As Greece exerted an incredible influence on Central Asia and Indian subcontinent in many ways, of which I have already provided clear sources. Which range from Astronomy, Architecture, coinage, 1000 year long Greek Buddha, to Rock cutting temples/caves (including the likes of Ajanta), jewelry, theater, up to small things like the Sari, that apparently (based on Indian scholars) have influence from Greece and Phoenicia, among other influences. It's easy as that.

Meanwhile, you can label me with anything you want, I don't share any of it.
 

Tsurugi's picture

Well. I thought what I was saying was pretty clear, but apparently not. You keep responding as though I am attacking Greece--which I am not--and as though I was advocating or proselytizing for India...which I was not.

In fact, that is what you were doing, only the other way 'round.....denigrating the Indian cu,lture, while preachin' Greek awesomeness.

I was simply trying to suggest you might should dial that back a bit. as there is neither need nor reason for such virtriol, which gets us nowhere and does not further understanding.

Your response has been only to dial it up, then carry on at length with it.

Way to go, me. Feedin' the trolls again.

EDIT: It should be pointed out that you are attacking India on the basis of its mythology; to the point where you are quoting passages for the sole purpose of sneering at them in contempt. So far, no one has had such bad taste or poor manners to do the same to the Ancient Greeks, who had just as rich, colorful, complex, and wonderfully weird a pantheon and parade of deities as India ever did.

Yes, but no one today is trying to claim all those Greek stories of gods and men were actually real, right?
Right. But ancient greeks clearly thougt they were real, just as ancient Indians thougt theirs were real . Expressing your contempt for one implies you should have the same contempt for the other. You want me to try and "explain" the idea of vimanas to you....perhaps you might care to explain the cyclopse, or the golden fleece? Defend the concept of Olympus? The Oracle of Delphi, the deeds of Heracles?

johnblack's picture

Arrogant replies Ptolemy, and the links you refer to in your comment are nonsense.

In regards to the conference, because one scientist started a campaign against the presentation, it doesn’t mean anything at all.

Diminishing the importance of the Indian culture is at least ignorant.

BTW, nobody tries to persuade you, there is no need for that … You are free to present your opinion here and have a civilized discussion, but it is not very nice of you to consider yourself right and everybody else is wrong – nobody will take your arguments seriously if you comment like this so what is the point ...

Tsurugi's picture

Well said, sir. I could not agree more.

while both arguements are compelling, we still have yet to address the question of :how and who were able to describe,in minute detail,the workings and operastion of space flight at such an early time?fanciful it may be ,however there is still the existance of documents describing such technology and that deserves to be addressed.arguing over who was first is folly,espcially when new discoveries are made daily,forcing us readjust our view of history and the world itself. i hope we all reserve the right to change our opinion in light of new information...the goal is to enlighten and be enlightened not belittle ourselves or others...namaste

Tsurugi's picture

"...especially when new discoveries are made daily, forcing us readjust our view of history and the world itself. i hope we all reserve the right to change our opinion in light of new information..."

Yes! I think this is critical to keep in mind whenever one is pursuing knowledge in any field of study. Science is an ongoing process, where current theory should be understood as a best-hypothesis based on known evidence, subject to change at any moment upon the discovery of new evidence. But a lot of people seem to want to treat current science as The Manual of Everything, Final Edition.

My favorite physicist, the late Dr. Richard Feynman, spoke and wrote at length on this subject, and summarized his thoughts by saying, "...whatever is not surrounded in uncertainty, cannot be the truth."

However, given the context of this discussion, perhaps another famous quote would be more apropos:
"Ipse se nihil scire id unum sciat"
....which can be translated as "I know one thing: that I know nothing," a quote attributed to Socrates by Plato, known as the Socratic Paradox.

As for India and the subject of Vimanas and prehistoric air or space flight, all I can say is, "Why not?" There is no evidence against the possibility--the period is called "prehistoric" for a reason, after all. And as you point out, there is the question of how an old text got so many things right on a subject they supposedly had no way of knowing anything about.

There is a family from India that lives in my small town, I often talk with them about India's Vedic past and the subject of Vimanas, of the Yuga cycle, and the implications of such things being true. They are always fascinating and fun discussions. The only disappointment came when I suggested we try and build a working Vimana based on the texts. They said it would be pointless, because such vehicles had been controlled with the Mind, which we could not do. Dream crushed.

Zuell's picture

I  guess your Greek

Zuell

rbflooringinstall's picture

I believe that airplanes are thousands upon thousands of years older than the Wright Brothers. Its evident in ancient text, art, and stories that flight was achieved all over the ancient world. Regardless of who or what taught us this knowledge, the idea of the ancients achieving flight is and should be recognized as fact. At least that's my opinion.

Peace and Love,

Ricky.

Seems to me this is like Leonardo DaVinci hypothesizing OR people several generations later after a global holocaust imagining what might the aircraft have looked like not having seen them in person. That aircraft existed is undeniable because we are not the first set of humans to walk the planet.

One Spirit of Universe's picture

The ones that demand evidence for ancient high tech machines are not thinking logically and with commen sense, like +Ptolemy336VV.  How long back do you expect such things to survive???

You can't demand all most impossible evidence, lack of evidence dose not prove it wrong.

And they where not so primitive either, dismissing ancient stories and legends as fiction is illogical, there is more truth in dose than what most mainstream academics claims, and they are not better equipt to evaluate dose text than any one else.  They just want every one else think that they are, an arogance I often bunch in to, they seem to think that they have some magical gift to determine what's true or not.

Little bit of delusions of grandeur they call it.

Peace&Love

Ptolemy336VV Ptolemy336VV Ptolemy336VV

One Spirit of Universe

Quote: "The ones that demand evidence for ancient high tech machines are not thinking logically and with commen sense, like +Ptolemy336VV.  How long back do you expect such things to survive??? "
------------------------------------------------------

Sure you do. It couldn't be more sensible and logical to do so!
There are also machines like the Antikythera machine of Ancient Greece, stated as the most advanced piece of technical engineering in the entire ancient world. If that wasn't there, then nobody would have even thought about it or believed it, that the Greeks had this level of Technology only to be rediscovered almost 2000 years later.

If we wouldn't have to as you say, then we can classify everything as truth. Pinokio, Jesus splitting the sea open, ancient walking robots in Homeric Epics, etc. 
And with images like the ones displayed in this article with flying horses etc, are also made thousands of years after the "Indians", where supposedly be able to "fly" makes it even more unbelievable. IF there was this ancient technology, it will be found. Even if it would just be remainders. You are saying you can't demand all evidence, HOW about start with ANY evidence, to start with, as there isn't anything yet, because with your faulty reasoning you can even make the incredible hulk or my little pony a reality

In the meantime, India consists of 900 languages, and hundreds of groups and peoples through India and it's history. We are not talking about a nation, but an area with many different peoples. That's why ironically the only language that connects all peoples to date is the English language, of which 54.000 words are Greek.
Even at the time of when Ancient Greece spread hellenization in Central Asia and the Indian Subcontinent, they witnessed many groups and peoples in different regions of what we call now "India" (which is a Greek word as well), had no written language. In other words, India consisted of many groups with all their own level of civilization.

Our litterature , both Sanskrit & Tamil, are far richer, older & larger than everything produced by the Greeks put together.. You are just deluded, and you don't know anything about the Hindu civilization(s). Voltaire said Pythagore went to India to learn his theorem... the fables come straight from India.. and so many words also come from India.. all basic words like MAN, are similar in many Indo-European languages.. even our numbers come directly from their Brahmi ancestors..

And by the way Dwarka was proved with Sonar Technology ! They mapped it's structures & size, it's bigger than Manhattan, and it's 100 feet below the sea, so it's definitely at least 12'000 years old..

Greeks and Europeans have the same ancestors than the Indians.... so whats the big fuss.

You need more education and less arrogance and ignorance. Google is your friend and FULL of information.. PEACE, OM SHANTI SHANTI SHANTI.

Removed by Moderator. 

Comments that are derogatory, rude, or offensive in any way are not tolerated on Ancient Origins.

 

And how old is the Antikythera machine, not that old, or do you think it's 12.000years old ?
Lack of physical evidence dose not mean it can't be true or prove your right. The old stories tell a lot of truths and those are evidence to, that's common sense and logical. Do you think you have a special gift that others don't have, to determine the truth, think again. I do my own research and put all the pieces of the puzzle together my self and my conclusions are more worth to me than yours, capice.

PTOLEMY336VV
harping about alll the dwaraka is analayzed only a brach float into it is itself the most ridiv=culous hatred about indian ness.
it was analyzed by most advanced technologies,why you are ignoring that all the evidences were scrutinized,

Sub: cosmology-modern Science
Cosmology is a myth or science- late Nobel laureate Alfven"s raises cosms quest to provide knowledge Base- space Cosmology vedas interlinks by me started since 1984 has 19 books -17 under uS copyrights and now 15 available in Lulu Distribution. It includes my invited talk-as book with log-scale light year projections-The Spirit of Scientific Research: Cosmology Vedas–Unity in Diversity: Vidyardhi Nanduri- TXU 1-731-982-SCIENCE &
TECHNOLOGY[S&T] in Ancient Indian Texts-Seminar-Indic Studies,2010
Indians need to a lot of spade work to provide Credibility through Cosmological index. The age of Ramayana is one crore fortysix lakhs of years –[14.6 million years]-author Late Kota venkatachalam- Brahmanda srusti- and many other books through detailed research for over 80 years before his death 1959. Books available –Arsha vijnana trust, Hyderabad or contact his Son dr nityananda sastry, Vijayawada,Andhra Pradesh, India

Sub: UTTHISTA-GET ORGANIZED OR PERISH
Cosology needs best of brains trust
Hindu cosmology ancient texts in consonance with Modern science- invited Key talk-by me at Tirupati-conderence 2007-organised by Itihasa Sankalana Samithi, TTD, SVETA highlights necessity- 4mode interaction -mere Sansrit or vedas to general texts- then dialogues-Digest- Modern Scientific knowledge background-Log-cale light years projections beyond
SUN and milky-way as base [MyBook available lulu]. This structure is missing while many may have curiosity but do not support real Scientific Scholars.Lord Sree Raghunayaka temple idols from chadalavada came to Gollapalli- sree Raghunadha swamy a few hundred yeas back. Analysis include Sree Bhadrachalam temple and there lies a clear Science that removes conflicts of minds -prevailing today- i am including salient features in my upcoming Book. cosmology knowledge base through vedas interlinks provides a clear route for World peace- perhaps one can
establish links to vatican-Mecca-Himalayan wisdom and Atma Lingam. Noble Cause : Human-Being, Environment, Divine Nature and Harmony- books by vidyardhi nandri-1993-2015

Roberto Peron's picture

I am happy to see the subject even discussed by the Science Conference in India.  Discussion opens the door for further discussion and in my mind discussion is healthy.  Many times archaeology tends to collect dust like relics in an old museum.  There comes a time to wipe the dust off and that is what discussion does so we can take a new look at things we think we know.  There should be no harm in simple discussion of any topic.  And if we don't discuss things?  Then it all become dogma (which I highly detest).

It is beyond question that Greece is one of the most researched sites in terms of archaeology and many fantastic discoveries have been made there as ancient Greece had a fantastic culture.  Research in India does not even begin to compare as we don't known as much about India as we do about Greece.  As for the vimanas maybe they were real flying machines or maybe they were simply a figment of the imagination and wishful thinking.  The ancient world had many ideas that never got off the ground just as our modern world today does.  But, we will never know unless we research, excavate, and discuss the possibility that just maybe those ancients in India did have some form of flying machines.  It is a possibility that needs to be discussed and we need to let the evidence speak for itself IF and when we find any such evidence.  To date all we have is tales and descriptions of such flying machines.  We need to look for evidence, physical evidence.  Likely we will not find much but somewhere there must be some small artifact that would indicate they did have such machines.  Finding it is the problem.  Until then all we can do is speculate.

Thank you, this is exactly my point.
I 100% agree that we need to keep any subject open for discussing.
Even if it is about the mechanised robots of Homeric epics of ancient Greece or flying in ancient India. And if ever evidence is found, then that is a great thing.

But as some have noticed, I rightfully so really dislike the behavior of some people who do already state and preach things as truth, whithout even one single evidence, archaeological site, or mechanical technology.

There is flight simulation software with real world physics and modelling capabilities around today. There wasn't much detail in the article but that diagram implies specific dimensions are available. It would therefore be possible to model one of these contraptions and experiment what power usage and thrust it would need to get airborne. We would then be able to see if the device was tenable. I say thrust because I will eat my shorts if that thing can get off the ground by flapping.

Roberto Peron's picture

I'm not so sure I'd like to fly in that contraption especially with flapping wings LOL.

Good morning passengers, I am Captain Patak. On behalf of Nirvana Airlines I welcome you aboard our twelve- engined Vimana 150...........

“The ancient planes had 40 small engines.” OK, show me one of them. For that matter, show me a vimana.

How do these people know that the Vedic texts were not written by the Jules Verne, HG Wells or Arthur Conan Doyle of their day? By the same logic, the French had nuclear submarines in the 19th century, the British have had a time travel machine since then as well, and the Hollow Earth nut-cases are actually right. Let's not forget Arthur C Clarke, either. That means the USA has already sent a manned space mission to Jupiter.

If they want anyone to take them seriously, the MUST provide actual artifacts. Viking sagas, for instance, were long thought to be fantasies as well, until people started to find archaeological evidence to prove that at least some of what they contain is true. So let's see the artifacts. Absent that, it remains interesting ancient science fiction.

Tsurugi's picture

Written fiction is a singularly modern phenomenon. Without the printing press to mass produce texts, and without nearly universal literacy such as we have had in the very recent past, writing fiction would be rather pointless. It takes a lot of work to pen a book by hand, and then there is only one copy, and even then you have to find someone capable of reading it. Works of fiction were put in song or verse, and spoken before an audience, not written down.

For this reason, I think it is safe to assume that the contents of old texts were at the very least thought to be truth by their authors.

Sigh. What science has devolved to.

This drivel really has to stop being called "science", for the speakers ignore the simple fact that the texts they are researching use metaphors for events which may or may not actually have occurred. That is "metaphors", meaning that they are not to be taken literally, as Von Daniken, for example, repeatedly does with every ancient artifact, text and unusual event he finds in ancient records.

If what they say is true, we would then have evidence of Indians traveling to other lands, Indian troops conquering other lands and Indian scientists traveling to other planets. We find nothing of the sort and never will. This is merely a small group of scientists trying to prop up ancient Indian history by claiming their country had advanced technology which patently did not exist.

The committee which allowed such papers to be presented were clearly thinking politically and not scientifically.

Yes, indeed. This reeks of political motivations.

Tsurugi's picture

We wouldn't necessarily have such evidence. If any of the things in the Vedix text are true, they occurred in deep prehistory, where evidence of human activity is exceedingly thin on the ground.

It's called "pre-history" for a reason.

ancient technology so advanced that they left little trace except in stone, while we rape mother earth of her resources and leave behind naught but pollution. In order to to innerstand a time when science and metaphysics were hand in hand we must break this egotistical inside the box mindset. always needing PROOF PROOF PROOF, when the only validation we need is looking within. we are dealing in a time when the vibrations on the planet were much higher. With people attuned to these vibrations able to do incredible things. It's a show of hubris to say the Greeks were the platform for civilization, when in actuality it is the Greeks that led to the downfall and eradication of the mysteries from our future generations. 13love

Seeing complexes like Elora or Ajanta caves, I believe advanced machines / Yantra existed.. After all, the British learned the all about industrialisation (look "indus") and machinery while being & exploring India.... wondering if many of those yantras have not ended up as metal for the Majesty..

RSS: MOTHER-CHOD INDIANS DWELL ON ANCIENT INDIAN SCIENCE BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOTHING TO SHOW IN THE PRESENT. THE WORLD’S GREATEST SCIENTIST IN THE PRESENT IS AN INDIAN BUT HE HAS BEEN SUPPRESSED WITH THE HELP OF 24-HOUR SATELLITE SURVEILLANCE FOR THE PAST 4 DECADES AND WITH THE FULL CO-OPERATION OF THEIR PRESENT DAY INDIAN SLAVES. THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGE THE CIA HAS DONE AND IS DOING TO INDIA IS ABOUT A TRILLION TIMES GREATER THAN THAT BY ISI AND ITS AFFILIATES. YET MODI AND COMPANY INSIST ON KISSING THE AMERICANS‘ ASS. HOW ABOUT KILLING ALL THE AMERICANS? INDIANS ARE ARGUING ABOUT ANCIENT INDIAN SCIENCE; HOW ABOUT THOUSANDS OF PRACTITIONERS OF TRANSCENDENTAL MEDITATION TODAY IN THE UNITED STATES AS WELL AS INDIA OVERCOMING GRAVITY EVERY DAY? HOW ABOUT MAHARISHI MAHESH YOGI WALKING THROUGH WALLS AS DEEPAK CHOPRA M.D. HAS DESCRIBED SEEING HIM DO IN ONE OF HIS BOOKS? HOW ABOUT THE AMERICANS‘ CRIMES AGAINST THE WORLD‘S GREATEST SCIENTIST WHO HAPPENS TO BE AN INDIAN? ‘GHAR VAPSI’ WAS NOT POWERFUL ENOUGH; IMMEDIATE DESTRUCTION OF ALL CHURCHES IN INDIA IS MORE POWERFUL THAN ‘GHAR VAPSI‘; NUCLEAR DESTRUCTION OF WASHINGTON AND NEW YORK WITH EMPLACED NUCLEAR WARHEADS WITH A WARNING THAT ADDITIONAL U.S. CITIES WILL BE SIMILARLY DESTROYED IF THERE IS ANY SIGN OF RETALIATION IS MORE POWERFUL THAN DESTRUCTION OF CHURCHES IN INDIA. MOTHER- CHOD MODI AND HIS CIA-RAW BACKERS HAVE RAMPED UP BORDER CLASHES WITH PAKISTAN IN PREPARATION FOR OBAMA’S VISIT TO MAKE THE ATMOSPHERE MORE WELCOMING OF HIM. RSS SHOULD REGARD NEUTRALISING SUCH MISCHIEF AND GETTING RID OF MODI AND RAW AS PART OF GHAR VAPSI. I HAVE SAID AMARTYA SEN WAS GIVEN THE NOBEL PRIZE AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR ME ( SEE “HOW INDIA’S ECONOMY CAN GROW 30% PER YEAR OR MORE” : HowIndiasEconomyCanGrowDOTblogspotDOTcom ) so he is returning the favor by saying that Indians learned mathematics from the Greeks, etc., though Indian civilization is much older and everything the Greeks knew they got from India.

You have just summoned the hoard of flying monkeys, good luck with that.

Tsurugi's picture

Oh, great. Here come the flying monkeys. I hope someone remembered to buy yellow spraypaint.

To further confound you all, it remains that the Vedas, although eventually spoken and written down...were, actually HEARD...by the Seers. Please double check Plotmy...Joseph Campbell is a good place to start. If you follow with Bastion, then things become more clear...to a seer....don't be afraid to extend beyond the known sciences...all of them have their limits and consternation of Knowledge's. Facts are fleeting...theories abound. How do archaeologists consider neuro-pschology? I think I smell something burning........!

I should also add I consider Ptolemy's supporting evidence valuable. Where I differ is in the evaluation of
context and comprehensiveness of a single discipline when considering numerous other scientific fields.

After reviewing Ptolemy's suggestions of evidence, which are many, I find that full corroboration of the Dispilio Tablets is still in question, as the authors of that claim are 'working on conservation of materials' prior to fully attacking the academic 'writing' paradigm with their carbon dating findings. I could not locate any multiplicity of testings...meaning the many reports simply repeated the authors claims again. As with the Vinca symbols, we should have to see a wider base of support, especially outside of archaeology...unless their are ostriches and sand in the field (heads buried). As we are talking about re-inventing the theory of writing, I would suggest that multiple authorities come forward and check the date claim. Carbon 14 has been notorious for false claims...and findings should always be corroborated, at least for the lay public...at which time, I will say...well, well.

Ptolemy...I would like to add, since the conversation has distinctly veered off mark of Indian Flying Machines...that the Dispilio symbols definitely have one symbol of a winged object, seeming to fly...

Therefore, according to Indian plane logic (of accepting only visuals)...the same logic could be used to say flying machines were around in 5300 bce as well. I am just kidding here....but hopefully the readers get the point. We all have to fight againt gullibility...since so much information is present in the world today...some of which is more accurate than others...

Absolutely zero empirical evidence to prove it. All we really have is a wonderful and imaginative mythology, nothing more. I would never want to diminish Indian culture in any way, but this is not scientific. It is a beautiful and inspiring story but there is nothing to back it up. No archaeology, no artifacts and no explanation what happened to these machines if this were true. A belief is simply a belief and beliefs are not science. ..no matter how badly people wish they were.

To my recollection the advanced pre-historical technologies referred to BY Indian "witnesses" proclaimed them to be from other civilizations at war with one another. The technology was not "homegrown" per se but rather "learned" from the Gods...or those whom appeared God-like.
Much as in Greek folklore.
Not to say the technology did not exist. I just don't believe it was the product of those who wrote about it. Anyone with the ability to develop such machinery would have full knowledge of its mechanics and be capable of an accurate description...or PHOTOS, lol.
Advancement of technology can occur at a rapid pace and then "disappear" just as fast. Our own civilization has gone from the dark ages to the space age in a mere millenium. Look at the scientific achievements in the last century alone. Humanity has existed on THIS planet for an unknown period of time. Perhaps 20-30 K years (or more) we have survived, prospered, advanced and fallen, only to start again.
Technologies change with various civilizations. There is much evidence of ancient civilizations throughout history and across the globe. I have no doubt we have forgotten/lost MOST of our history to time.
Keep an open mind but not so much that your brain falls out of your head, lol.

Sub; :Knowledge Base-Cosmology Vedas Interlinks
India needs to protect Knowledge base. Support original contributions in time. This is spirit of cosmos quest

PTOLEMY336VV
harping about alll the dwaraka is analayzed only a brach float into it is itself the most ridiv=culous hatred about indian ness.
it was analyzed by most advanced technologies,why you are ignoring that all the evidences were scrutinized,

Do you think indian oceonography experts and archeologists were just idiots and they didn't follow modern scientific equipments and technical excellency?

Why are you ignoring that those facts were the part and parcel of a scientific report which covers more than the info you and we are just referencing only extracts.Do you think that no international expert could track if there is a bluff in the indian explorers theory!

There are people who are born here from Ramayana days....but no one will get that data because of arrogance with everyone. So, a small item can be said here.

Ramayana time had two groups of civilization:

1. The whole planet with Humans (Blacks, Whites, Indians, and Chinese) working together.

2. Hanumana Group...it was real, they were the first civilization before Humans....And they moved to another planet.

The reason Humans from that part left is because serious Ice Planet...except just a few were left in key areas.

And they had serious space age....the data that is written in Sanskrit is correct as a description to kids.....That is all I can say...

Oh...the time was way before....many thousand years before...

Scientific Edge-Sree ramayanam-Cosmology Vedas Interlinks
Inter-disciplinary studies
The spirit of science needs to advance- to catch-up with Cosmology Digest and Cosmos Quest through ancient texts
The Science of Philosophy and philosophy of Science both get integrated beyond Horse nebulae and search beyond Agni-Mukham
Some typical Scientific edge seem to be missing or ignored by many scholars.one naturally comes-up with better understanding of Sree Ramayanam as a link to Sanatana Dharma and Divine episode.Research is in progress to link-up Sree Rama Avatara attribute around 1,46,16000 years back. Purpose is to remove Conflicts in Minds and develop the subject as it is.

My friend was born during Ramayana and was the computer control engineer in the space ship. That was about 100,000 years ago.

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